* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. AND THE, [00:00:01] UH, EVERYTHING THAT WILL BE SAID [Wetlands Board on April 5, 2025.] NOW IS ON PUBLIC RECORD. THANK YOU, MA'AM. UH, GOOD MORNING. IT'S 10 O'CLOCK. I'D LIKE TO CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER. UH, WELCOME TO THE APRIL, 2025 MEETING HELD OVER FROM LAST MONTH. SO WE HAVE APRIL AND MAY. UM, WELL, GOING THROUGH THE INTRODUCTORY REMARKS, PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO SILENCE OR TURN OFF CELL PHONES, ET CETERA. WETLANDS BOARD CONSISTS OF FIVE MEMBERS. APPROVAL OF PERMITS REQUIRES A MAJORITY VOTE OR THREE YAY VOTES. TODAY WE HELP ALL FIVE MEMBERS. WE HAVE A QUORUM, UH, FROM MY RIGHT TO LEFT, MR. ICK, VICE CHAIR. MR. WARD, THIS IS MR. JEAN WAYNE TAYLOR, AND MR. HANK BADGER ON T LEE BIRD. IF YOU, UH, WOULD ALLOW ME, I'D LIKE TO, UM, RECOGNIZE STAFF MEMBERS AND SO FORTH. UH, MS. JULIE FLOYD, UH, ENVIRONMENTAL PERMIT SPECIALIST, MS. GINGER HARMON, THE ADMINISTRATIVE ASSISTANT, MR. PAUL WATSON, WHO IS, UH, DEPUTY DIRECTOR OF CODE ADMINISTRATIVE DIVISION. AND MR. LEE HAMID JUST CAME IN. WELCOME, THE DEPUTY DIRECTOR ADMINISTRATOR AND MS. CLAIRE GORMAN. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING. SHE'S WITH VIRGINIA MARINE RESOURCES COMMISSION. THE BOARD IS AWARE OF AND COMPLIES AS CLOSELY AS POSSIBLE TO THE OBJECTIVES OF THE VIRGINIA MARINE RESOURCES COMMISSIONS POLICY OF NO NET LOSS. ALL APPROVED PERMITS ARE GRANTED FOR A TWO YEAR PERIOD FROM THE DATE OF THE HEARING, UNLESS, UH, SPECIFIED ALL PERSONS SPEAKING BEFORE THIS BOARD WILL BE SWORN IN. IF WE MIGHT MOVE AHEAD. UM, THERE WERE SOME CHANGES, SO I HOPE EVERYONE HAS HAD TIME TO LOOK OVER THE AGENDA. ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? IF NOT, I'D LIKE TO CALL FOR A VOTE TO ACCEPT THE AGENDA. THANK YOU, SIR. AND A SECOND. THANK YOU, MR. WARD. UH, THE AGENDA IS ACCEPTED. NEXT MINUTES OF LAST MONTH. WE HAVE A NEW SET. UH, JUST A LITTLE BIT OF CHANGE, SO I HOPE EVERYONE'S HAD TIME TO LOOK OVER LAST MONTH'S MEETING. ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS FROM THE BOARD? CALL FOR A MOTION. UH, THIS IS TIM ICK. I MAKE A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE MINUTES FROM, UH, I GUESS APRIL, CORRECT. MARCH, ACTUALLY. THANK YOU. . SECOND PLEASE. SECOND. THANK YOU MR. BADGER AND A VOTE. AYE. THANK YOU. THEY'RE IN THE BOOK. ART. WE'LL MOVE ALONG. WE'RE GONNA GO TO, UH, NEW BUSINESS. FIRST, UH, ITEM FOUR IS, UH, 4.01 JPA 20 25 0 5 2 1. IT'S VIRGINIA PORT AUTHORITY DREDGING OF SLOOP GUT, UH, TO EXISTING OLD NORTH DOCK. MR. WATSON, WOULD YOU PLEASE LET ME SWEAR YOU IN AND GIVE A SYNN? UH, DO YOU SWEAR TO TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH AT ALL MATTERS BEFORE THIS BOARD? I DO. THANK YOU, SIR. WOULD YOU TAKE US THROUGH WHAT YOU KNOW? YEAH. UH, SO THE FIRST ONE WE HAVE IS VIRGINIA PORT AUTHORITY, DREDGING OF SLEEP GUT. AND, UH, WHILE I DID HAVE A LONGER PRESENTATION, UH, STANTEC FORWARDED THEIR PRESENTATION TO ME AND IT WAS ALMOST ENTIRELY DUPLICATIVE. SO I'M GONNA LEAVE MOST OF THE MAPS OR PRETTY MUCH ALL THE MAPS TO THEM AND JUST PROVIDE SOME BASIC INFORMATION AND PHOTOGRAPHS. UH, THIS OF COURSE, IS ON WALLOPS ISLAND, AND IT'S THE DREDGING OF A GUT UP TO AN EXISTING DOCK OF NO WORK ON THE DOCK, JUST THE DREDGING OF THE GUT. UM, AND THE MOST IMPORTANT, UH, PIECE OF INFORMATION OR POINT OF DISCUSSION I WANTED TO PUT FORTH IS THE, UH, CONVERSION OF NON VEGITATIVE WETLANDS TO SUB AQUEOUS BOTTOM. UM, THERE'S NO VEGETATION WITHIN, UH, THE DREDGING FOOTPRINT OR THE TWO TIMES OR FOUR TIMES, UH, OR, OR THE TWO TIMES, UH, AND FOUR TIMES, UH, MAPS. AND ESSENTIALLY IT'S JUST, UH, GOING MUD TO MUD. UH, NON VEGITATIVE WETLAND MUD IS, UH, BEING LOWERED DOWN, UM, TO SUB AQUEOUS BOTTOM MUD. AND, UH, DISCUSSED THIS WITH BMRC. THIS IS NOT A, UH, LOSS. YOU CAN EITHER HAVE A LOSS AGAIN OR A CONVERSION, AND THIS IS A CONVERSION. SO THERE ARE NO NET LOSS POLICY, UH, WOULD NOT APPLY. EVERYBODY UNDERSTAND THAT? MM-HMM . UM, HERE'S JUST THE OVERALL MAP OF, OF THE DREDGING [00:05:01] PROJECT FROM, UH, NORTH, OBVIOUSLY TO SOUTH AND THE SOUTH WHERE IT SAYS, WHILE IT'S FLIGHT FACILITY IS THE EXISTING DOCK. AND WE HAD A, UH, BOAT VISIT TO, UH, I GUESS THE TOP MAP, THE MIDDLE MAP, AND PROBABLY GOT MAYBE A THIRD OF THE WAY INTO THE BOTTOM MAP UNTIL WE HIT BOTTOM. UH, BUT BMRC TOOK US OUT ON A BOAT RIDE, UH, A WEEK OR SO AGO. AND HERE, JUST PICTURES AS WE WERE COMING INTO THE GUT. NOT A LOT TO SEE OTHER THAN MARSHALL ON EITHER SIDE AS WE ENTERED ONE AFTER THE OTHER. AND THIS IS APPROACHING THE DOCK, AND I BELIEVE THIS IS ABOUT AS FAR AS WE GOT. OKAY. UM, STANTEC HAS A, UH, PRESENTATION THEY WOULD LIKE TO MAKE NOW, AND LIKE I SAID, IT WOULD, I WAS ENTIRELY DUPLICATIVE OF THE REST OF MY PRESENTATION, SO I WOULD ALLOW THEM TO, UH, UH, TO GO THROUGH THEIR PRESENTATION NOW. ALRIGHT, DON'T, THANK YOU, SIR. I'VE GOTTA SWITCH OUT THE THUMB DRIVE. IT'LL TAKE ME JUST A MINUTE. YOU TAKE YOUR TIME, SIR. AND, UH, THIS IS MR. CHUCK LEY. YES, SIR. UH, MAY I SWEAR YOU IN? YOU MAY. DO YOU, YES. OBVIOUSLY SWEAR TO TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH IN ALL MATTERS BEFORE THIS BOARD. I DO THANK YOU FOR, JUST ALLOW HIM A LONG OR TWO. AND JUST FOR THE RECORD, MY ADDRESS IS, UH, 52 0 9 CENTER STREET, WILLIAMSBURG, VIRGINIA, 2 3 1 8. EIGHT. THANK YOU, SIR. LET ME GET MY GRANDCHILDREN IN HERE. . THEY'RE ABOUT EIGHT. TAKE THAT FOR YOU. YOU SEE THAT? OKAY. THANK YOU. UM, SO AS PAUL POINTED OUT, UH, THE PROJECT LOCATION, UH, RELATIVE TO WALL OF ISLAND, YOU CAN SEE THE WHITE HATCH LINE, UH, LEADING OUT TO THE CHANNEL. UM, SO THE APPLICANTS IN THIS CASE ARE THE VIRGINIA PORT AUTHORITY. UH, CO-APPLICANT IS ROCKET LAB. UM, AS I SAID, STANTEC IS THE, UH, AGENT FOR THE APPLICANT. UM, THE PURPOSE OF THE PROJECT IS TO DELIVER ROCKET COMPONENTS TO, UH, WALLOPS FLIGHT FACILITY SO THAT THEY CAN BE TRANSPORTED TO THE NEUTRON ASSEMBLY BUILDING, UH, AND THEN DEPLOYED AT WALLOPS ISLAND. UM, TO ACHIEVE THIS, UH, LOOKING AT DREDGING OF SLOOP GUT, APPROXIMATELY 59,000 CUBIC YARDS OF MATERIAL, UM, TO A DEPTH OF MINUS SEVEN FEET. AND YOU MAY KNOW, UH, WITH YOUR HISTORY, UH, ON THE EASTERN SHORE, BUT THAT GUT WAS DREDGED PREVIOUSLY IN THE THIRTIES AND THE FIFTIES, UM, BY, UH, THE COAST GUARD IN THE NAVY. UM, IT HASN'T BEEN MAINTAINED IN QUITE A WHILE, SO YOU HAVE QUITE A BIT OF SEDIMENT, UH, ACCUMULATED AT THE HEAD OF THE GUT AND THEN AT THE MOUTH WHERE IT JOINS THE CHANNEL, UM, THERE ARE PORTIONS WITH ALONG THE CHANNEL, UH, THAT REQUIRE VERY LITTLE DREDGING AND IN SOME AREAS DEEPER THAN SEVEN FEET CURRENTLY. SO, UM, SO THIS HAS BEEN A FAIRLY AGGRESSIVE AND FAST-PACED PROJECT. UM, LOOKING AT WHERE WE MIGHT DISPOSE OF THE MATERIAL THAT'S COMING OUT OF HERE. UM, WE LOOKED AT LOCAL STAGING AREAS, UM, LOOKED [00:10:01] AT BENEFICIAL REUSE, UH, USING IT FOR EITHER BEACH NOURISHMENT OR MARSH CREATION. UM, AT THE SAME TIME, WE WERE DOING GEOTECHNICAL TESTING IN FEBRUARY OF THIS YEAR, UM, AND WE CAME UP WITH THE SEDIMENTS IN THE, AT THE HEAD OF THE GUT, HAVE A HIGHER CONCENTRATION OF TOTAL PETROLEUM HYDROCARBONS IN THE, UH, ORGANIC OIL RANGE ORGANICS, UH, GREATER THAN 200 MILLIGRAMS PER KILOGRAM, WHICH JUST MEANT YOU COULDN'T PUT IT ON A FARM FIELD. YOU COULDN'T DO LAND APPLICATION. IT NEEDS TO, UM, BE DISPOSED OF AN APPROPRIATE FACILITY. UM, GIVEN THAT AND, AND LOOKING AT AVAILABLE OPTIONS, WE ENACT UP IN CHARLES CITY COUNTY. UM, YOU MAY OR MAY NOT BE FAMILIAR WITH THAT, BUT IT IS AN APPROVED DREDGE MATERIAL, UH, DISPOSAL AREA. AND SO THAT IS CURRENTLY WHAT IS PROPOSED. I KNOW IT'S A LONG TREK, UH, FROM WALLOPS TO CHARLES CITY. UM, BUT PART OF THE, WE'LL GET ON THE PURPOSE AND NEED. PART OF THE REASON FOR THIS WAS TO CREATE A PREDICTABLE TIMELINE TO ALLOW THEM TO BE ABLE TO DELIVER COMPONENTS TO THE ISLAND. UM, A HEAT MAP, I CALL IT A HEAT MAP, UH, BASICALLY SHOWS YOU WHERE THE MAJORITY OF THE DREDGING IS OCCURRING, THE REDDER COLORS, MORE DREDGING THE YELLOWS LESS, AND IN THIS CASE, LESS THAN OR ZERO TO TWO FEET FOR QUITE A BIT OF THE CHANNEL. IT, IT'S GONNA JUST BE CLEANED UP IN CERTAIN AREAS. UM, BUT AGAIN, AT THE HEAD, UH, AND AT THE MOUTH OR WHERE THE MAJORITY OF THE DREDGING IS OCCURRING, THE DREDGE PLAN, UM, SHOWING THE BASIN, UH, ADJACENT TO THE EXISTING DOCK, UH, AND EXTENDING OUT. AND DOES THIS HAVE A POINTER ON? I DON'T THINK SO. I DON'T THINK SO. YOU WANT, YOU WANT A POINTER, SHE THINKS IT? OH, YES, IT DOES. UM, SO THE AREA IN THIS LOCATION IS THE AREA OF INTERTIDAL, UM, MUDFLAT THAT WILL BE, UH, IMPACTED AS A, A RESULT OF THIS DREDGING, UM, GONNA THROUGH THE MIDDLE OF THE CHANNEL AND THEN AT THE MOUTH, UH, AGAIN, THE INTERTIDAL AREA THAT IS GONNA BE IMPACTED BY THIS, UM, IT'S ABOUT FOUR. SO WE, THE DREDGE PLANS, UM, SHOW AREAS OF A BOX CUT, THEN THE TWO X BUFFER, AND THEN THERE'S A FOUR X BUFFER. AND THE TWO X OR THE BOX CUT PLUS THE TWO X BUFFER IS ABOUT 14,000, UH, SQUARE FEET OF INTERTIDAL AREA. I DON'T KNOW THAT WE'LL ACTUALLY GET INTO THE FOUR X BUFFER WITH THE DREDGE CUT, UM, BECAUSE IT'S OUTSIDE OF OUR DREDGED PRISM FOR THE MOST PART. BUT, UM, THE AGENCIES ASK US TO PUT THAT IN ON THE PLANS, UM, JUST TO SOME CROSS SECTIONS OF THE PROPOSED CUT, AGAIN, GOING TO MINUS SEVEN FEET. WE TALKED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE IMPACTS. YOU KNOW, IT'S A 5,000 FOOT CHANNEL, UH, ABOUT 60,000 YARDS OF MATERIAL. AND WE ALREADY MENTIONED THE IMPACTS, UH, APPLICATION WAS SUBMITTED IN MARCH, UH, CURRENTLY UNDER REVIEW BY ALL OF THE, UH, REGULATORY AGENCIES, YOURSELF INCLUDED, UM, AS WELL AS THE CCMA CONSISTENCY, DETERMINATION. UM, AND THIS MATTER WILL, MY UNDERSTANDING IS BE HELD, UH, IN FRONT OF THE COMMISSION THE END OF THIS MONTH. SO THE CORES PUBLIC NOTICE ENDS THE NINTH, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN. SO I BELIEVE THAT'S, YEP, THAT'S THE LAST SLIDE. I'LL BE HAPPY TO ENTERTAIN ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE. BOARD MEMBERS, ANY QUESTIONS? I, I KNOW YOU'RE TRYING TO ADDRESS MATERIALS TO, UH, CHARLES CITY. UM, IS, IS IT JUST PART OF IT THAT'S CONTAMINATED BECAUSE, AND WHY I'M ASKING THE ACETATE IS DOING A MARSH REPLENISHMENT PROJECT AND THE REASON WHY THEY CAN'T DO IT IS BECAUSE THEY CAN'T GET THE MATERIALS. SO I WAS JUST TRYING TO ACCOMMODATE THEM FOR DOING THAT PROJECT. YEAH, THAT'S THE REASON TO, COULD IT, UM, I GUESS THAT QUESTION WOULD ACTUALLY BETTER BE, IS IT OF THAT MATERIALS THAT WOULD BE NON CONTAMINATED, SUITABLE FOR THEIR PROJECT? SO THERE IS A FAIR, A HIGHER PERCENTAGE OF FINES AND CLAYS THAN THEY'D LIKE [00:15:01] FOR BEACH NOURISHMENT. IT'S APPROXIMATELY 20%, BUT THERE IS A PORTION OF IT THAT'S NOT CONTAMINATED WITH, UH, BUT IT'S NOT SUITABLE FOR THEIR, NOT REALLY SUITABLE FOR FEATURE. OKAY. THANK, I'M JUST TRYING TO, YOU KNOW, LOOK OUT FOR A PAST PROJECT THAT CAME THROUGH HERE AND THE BEST REASON I'VE NOT DONE IT AND THEY HAVE ON THE MATERIALS. UNDERSTOOD. OKAY. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM BOARD MEMBERS? ONE, ONE QUICK QUESTION, AND I THINK I KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS, BUT I'M GONNA ASK IT ANYWAY. UM, THIS IS NOT EXEMPT FROM THE WETLANDS BOARD BECAUSE THE PORT AUTHORITY DOESN'T OWN OR LEASE THE AREA THAT'S BEING IMPACTED. CORRECT. OKAY, I UNDERSTAND. OKAY. UH, THANK YOU. UH, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN, WE MAY CALL YOU BACK, SO DON'T RUN AWAY. PLEASE. UH, ANYONE ELSE HERE TO SPEAK SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR JPA? YES, SIR. MR. DEN, I THINK I STILL HAVE TO SWEAR YOU IN. OKAY. CONFIRM OR SWEAR YOU TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH IN ALL MATTERS. BEFORE THIS, BEFORE I DO CARRY ON, SIR, MY ONLY COMMENT WAS TO KIND OF PUT THIS PROJECT IN A LARGER ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CONTEXT, BECAUSE THOSE OF US IN THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATION HAVE BEEN WATCHING CERTAIN STATE LEVEL BUDGET, UH, UH, CONSIDERATIONS HERE. SO THIS PROJECT IS ACTUALLY BEING PAID FOR WITH, UH, WITH AN EARMARK, UH, ACHIEVED BY, UH, DELEGATE . ROCKET LAB IS NOT THE ONLY COMPANY WHO HAS COME TO ME OR TO MIKE MASON OR THE, UH, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT FOLKS IN THE COUNTY, UH, TALKING ABOUT THE NEED FOR ALTERNATE ACCESS TO THE ISLAND AND TO SOME OF THE, UM, UH, SOME OF THE MANUFACTURING FACILITIES, MOST NOTABLY ROCKET LAB. BUT THERE ARE THE OTHER ALTERNATIVES FOR, UH, FOR BRINGING THOSE COMPONENTS TO MACK COUNTY ARE, UH, ARE NON-STARTERS. FOR EXAMPLE, WE ALL KNOW THAT QUEEN SOUND WAS EXPLORED AND THAT WAS A VERY QUICK NO, UH, TRYING TO BRING SOME OF THESE LARGER COMPONENTS OVER THE ROAD, ESPECIALLY GIVEN THE CHALLENGES OF THINGS LIKE, UH, SIGNAL ARMS AND POWER POLES AND THAT KIND OF THING, PARTICULARLY ALL THE WAY FROM MIDDLE RIVER, MARYLAND WOULD LIKEWISE BE PROBLEMATIC. PLUS THEY'D ALSO HAVE TO GET IT OVER THE, UH, CHESAPEAKE, UH, BAY BRIDGE, UH, NEAR ANNAPOLIS. SO AGAIN, WE'VE GOT MULTIPLE USERS WHO COULD BENEFIT FROM THIS PROJECT. AND, UH, AND THERE ARE SOME OTHER, UH, YOU KNOW, EYES ON THIS, UH, NOT ON JUST THIS DECISION, BUT ON THE PROJECT AS A WHOLE. AND THAT CONCLUDES MY COMMENTS. I CAN FIELD OF ANY QUESTIONS AT THIS TIME. THANK YOU. ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. BIN? ALRIGHT. THANK YOU SIR. ANYONE ELSE HERE TO SPEAK SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THIS JPA? NOT, I'D LIKE TO CLOSE THE FLOOR, OPEN IT TO PUBLIC COMMENT. NO PUBLIC COMMENT. FLOORS CLOSED. GOING OPEN THE BOARD DISCUSSION. UH, SIR, SO I THINK WHAT I JUST SORT OF CORRECT ME WHEN I MAKE THE MISTAKE, THIS IS A HISTORICALLY DREDGED AREA AT THIS TIME AND THEY'RE JUST GOING TO MAKE IT WELL, IT JUST NEEDS TO BE RE DREDGED AND THEY'RE ALSO MAKING IT DEEPER IN CERTAIN AREAS. IS THAT ESSENTIALLY, MAY I ASK YOU TO COME BACK UP AND JUST MAKE SURE? I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE I GET THE FULL UNDERSTANDING HERE. UH, IT WAS PREVIOUSLY DREDGED AND THEY ARE REESTABLISHING DEPTHS IN AREAS THAT WERE PREVIOUSLY DREDGED. SO IT WAS AT, IT'S AT THE SAME PREVIOUS LEVEL AS BEFORE. IT IS, REED HAS NO ADDITIONAL DEPTH PER SE. THERE IS, UM, THERE WERE IN THOSE TWO DIFFERENT DREDGE CYCLES THAT I MENTIONED, THEY, SORRY, IT'S SILENCED, BUT IT'S STILL GOING. UM, IN THOSE TWO PREVIOUS DRED DEPTH, I HAD TO LOOK FAIRLY CLOSELY AT THE PLANS, UM, BECAUSE ONE OF THEM SHOWED THE BASIN BEING DREDGED, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, TO EIGHT FEET AND THE APPROACH TO FOUR FEET. BUT IN THE SECOND SET OF DRAWINGS, I BELIEVE THE ENTIRE CHANNEL WAS DREDGED TO EIGHT FEET. EIGHT FEET. OKAY. ALRIGHT. AND IS IT GONNA BE A LITTLE BIT WIDER TOO, OR IS THAT YOUR TWO X FOUR X BUCKET? ACTUALLY, WE TRIED TO KEEP IT AS NARROW AS POSSIBLE WITHOUT GETTING INTO THE VEGETATED WETLANDS. GOTCHA. UM, 'CAUSE PART OF THE ISSUE THERE IS IN TALKING TO THE DREDGE OP, THE TUG OPERATORS, THEY'D RATHER GO TO 12 FEET, UH, AND HAVE A WIDER CHANNEL FOR MANEUVERABILITY. UM, BUT WE SHALLOWED IT AND MADE IT NARROWER TO AVOID THE VEGETATED WETLANDS AND THEY FEEL LIKE WITH A SMALLER [00:20:01] TUG THAT THEY CAN NAVIGATE UP THROUGH THE CHANNEL SAFELY. VERY GOOD. THANK YOU. UHHUH? EXCUSE ME. SORRY. SORRY, THIS IS A QUESTION. I JUST WANTED IT ON THE RECORD. UH, THERE WAS SOME CONCERNS THAT WE TALKED ABOUT IN OUR MEETING ON THE WATER, UH, ABOUT POSSIBLE, UH, AMMUNITION AND, UM, I DUNNO IF IT WAS BOMBS OR WHATEVER, BUT THEY USED UXO, THEY USED THAT AREA FOR SOME OTHER ISSUES AS FAR AS, UH, I GUESS WORLD WAR II OR WHATEVER, UH, AND YOU'VE LOOKED INTO THAT AND THERE'S, THERE'S NO ISSUE THERE BECAUSE OF THE FACT THAT IT'S BEEN DREDGED PREVIOUSLY. OKAY. MY SENTIMENT IS THAT IT'S A, UH, LOW RISK. OKAY. THANK, THANK YOU. ANY OTHER, ANYTHING ELSE, GENTLEMEN? THANK YOU, SIR. UM, I, MR. CHAIR, I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM MS. GORMAN, IF YOU DON'T MIND. I WOULD. OH, MR. YOU, YOU JUST MAKE ME TO . MS. GORMAN, WOULD YOU PLEASE APPROACH TO SWEAR YOU IN? DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT YOU'LL TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH IN ALL MATTERS BEFORE THIS BOARD? I DO. THANK YOU, MS. CLARA GOMAN, UH, WOULD YOU GIVE US YOUR SYNOPSIS? SURE. UM, SO THIS PROJECT IS UNDER REVIEW BY BY VMRC AS WELL. UM, THEY'RE PURSUING A CE AQUEOUS PERMIT FROM US. IT'LL LIKELY BE HEARD BY THE COMMISSION LATER THIS MONTH. UM, AND I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY OTHER QUESTIONS Y'ALL MAY HAVE FOR ME. ALRIGHT, WELL I THINK WE ALL KNEW THAT PART, BUT THERE MUST BE, WELL, I'M SORT CURIOUS ABOUT THIS. THERE'S UNVEGETATED WETLANDS AND IT'S GONNA GET DROPPED INTO THE SO AQUEOUS LAYER MM-HMM . AND THERE'S GONNA BE NO REGARDS TO MITIGATION THERE IN TERMS, IT'S A CON NO NET LOSS. IT'S A CONVERSION. IS IT NOT CONVERSION? CORRECT. SO NON VEGETATED WETLANDS, UM, BEING CH CONVERTED TO SE AQUEOUS BOTTOM IS NOT A LOSS. OKAY. AND THAT'S BECAUSE IT'S NOT BEING CONVERTED TO EVIDENCE. AND THAT'S JUST THE STANDARD PRACTICE THAT THE VMRC HAS. CORRECTION IN REGARDS TO NON VEGITATIVE WETLANDS GONNA SAVE . IT'S SIMILAR TO, UM, STONE GOING ON NON, NON VEGETATED WET WETLANDS. IT'S A CONVERSION OF HABITAT WOULD LOST. WOULD YOU REPEAT THAT, MA'AM? IT'S THE SAME AS WHAT? IT'S SIMILAR TO THE CONVERSION THAT WE TYPICALLY SEE FROM NON VEGETATED WETLANDS TO RIP WRAP. YES. OKAY. SO IT'S A CONVERSION TO A DIFFERENT TYPE OF HABITAT? YES. IT'S NOT A LOSS, IT'S NOT A BULKHEAD FILL, FOR EXAMPLE. I UNDERSTAND. AND JUST FOR THE RECORD, WE ARE, I ALREADY KNOW THIS, UH, THERE IS SOME WORK BEING DONE ON THE SEA WALL AND THE BEACH SIDE, BUT 'CAUSE AKIMA COUNTY DOESN'T HAVE A BEACH AND DUNES ORDINANCE THAT'S OUTSIDE OUR JURISDICTION. CORRECT. IN REGARDS TO THE BEACH SIDE OF THE, OF THE, OF THE WORK BEING DONE, ARE YOU REFERRING TO THE, THE SHORELINE RESTORATION PROJECT? YES. ON WALLOP? YEAH. THAT'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PROJECT. UM, I HAVE NOT SEEN A JPA FOR THAT YET. AND YOU ARE CORRECT THAT MACK HAS NOT ADOPTED THE DUNAN BEACH ORDINANCE, SO THAT WOULD FALL UNDER BMCS FOR YOU? I JUST ON THE RECORD. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. SURE, THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? YES. IS, IS ANY OF THAT, UM, MANMADE ON THE MARSHES OR IS THIS ALL NATURAL? UM, WE DON'T, WE COULDN'T FIND ANY EVIDENCE THAT IT WAS MANMADE. I THINK PROBABLY TOWARDS THE DOCK. SOME OF IT MIGHT BE, BUT IT WAS VERY DIFFICULT TO TELL, UM, GIVEN HOW LONG THE CHANNEL'S KIND HAVE BEEN THERE, SO. ALRIGHT. ANYONE ELSE? THANK YOU. THANK, APPRECIATE IT. UH, ANY OTHER COMMENTS, UM, AT ALL FROM THE BOARD? ALRIGHT. ALL RIGHT. UM, THERE IS, THERE IS NO, UH, VEGETATED INVOLVED. UM, IT'S MERELY A CONVERSION. SO, UM, I, I GUESS I DO WANT TO ASK A QUE SO THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF SQUARE FOOT CONVERSION WAS, WAS APPROXIMATELY, IT WAS APPROXIMATELY 14,000 SQUARE FEET IN THE BOX CUT AND THE TWO X. OKAY. OKAY. THANK YOU. THAT'S FINE. YOU ALSO HEARD ABOUT THE CUBIC YARDAGE AND MATERIAL THEY'RE GONNA BE MOVING AROUND. THAT'S QUITE AN UNDERTAKING, SIR. ALRIGHT. UH, I THINK BASICALLY, UH, OUR VOTE RIGHT NOW IS TO, UH, WITH, WITH NO VEGETATED LOSS, IT'S GONNA BE MERELY A, A MOTION AND VOTE TO ALLOW THEM TO PROCEED WITH WHAT, UH, LITTLE PORTION WE ARE INVOLVED IN. SO IF THAT'S THE CASE, I'D LIKE TO ASK FOR A MOTION. MR. CHAIRMAN, I'LL MAKE A MOTION. WE APPROVE JPA 2025 DASH 0 5 21 AS PRESENTED WITH NOTING THAT THE NON VEGITATIVE WETLAND IS CHANGED THE SUB AND NOTE AND IT'S JUST A CONVERGENCE SO THERE'S NO MITIGATION REQUIRES. CORRECT. ALRIGHT, I'LL SECOND THAT. THANK YOU SIR. UH, CALL FOR A VOTE. AYE, AYE, UH, IT'S UNANIMOUS [00:25:02] TWO YEARS, SIR. UM, I'M SURE YOU'RE AWARE OF THAT. APPROVED FOR TWO YEARS AND OF COURSE RIDICULOUS TO EVEN BRING IT UP. BUT, UH, GRANT'S NO AUTHORITY TO, UH, UH, ENCROACH ON THE PROPERTIES OF OTHER PEOPLE. ALRIGHT. YES, SIR. THAT'S IN THE BOOK. NEXT. CONTINUING WITH NEW BUSINESS IS, UH, JPA 2 0 2 5 DASH 0 4 9 1. IT'S THE NATURE OF CONSERVANCY AND IT IS, UH, TITLED WETLANDS UH, RESTORATION SITE CONNECTED TO THE MAT FUNGO RIVER. UH, MR. WATSON, SIR, YOU'VE BEEN SWORN IN. WOULD YOU PLEASE GIVE US SYNOPSIS? SURE. UM, SO THIS IS ACTUALLY A PROJECT THAT WAS BEFORE THE, UH, BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS ALMOST EXACTLY TWO YEARS AGO. UM, THEY WERE GRANTED A SPECIAL USE PERMIT. THE SPECIAL USE PERMITS ARE ONLY GOOD FOR TWO YEARS AND THEY'LL BE GOING BACK IN FRONT OF THE BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS ON WEDNESDAY FOR AN EXTENSION OF THAT PERMIT, AS WELL AS A FEW CONDITION CHANGES OF JUST GETTING THINGS IN LINE TO BEGIN CONSTRUCTION. SO THIS IS, UH, ON THE SOUTHERN END OF THE COUNTY ON WILLOWDALE DRIVE, UH, BOTH SIDES OF WILLOWDALE DRIVE. IT'S A CREATION OF A WETLANDS MITIGATION BANK, UH, PRESENTLY, UH, USED AS FARMLAND. AND, UH, THE COMPENSATION HERE IS 863 SQUARE FEET. AND I'LL ADDRESS THIS IN MORE DETAIL AT THE END OF THIS PRESENTATION, BUT THEY'RE REQUESTING ONSITE COMPENSATION, UH, MEANING IT WOULD BE, UH, PART OF THIS WETLANDS MITIGATION BANK THAT THEY WOULD BE PROVIDING. COMPENSATION RIGHT HERE IS A GENERAL VICINITY MAP. UH, THEY PROVIDED, UH, AND, UH, YOU CAN SEE PAINTER IN THE UPPER LEFT HAND CORNER. AND THIS IS, UH, RIGHT OFF, UH, WHERE COLE KILN ROAD MEETS, UH, SEASIDE ROAD. AND HERE'S A CLOSEUP OF THE SITE. THE RED SQUARE, UH, IS WHERE THE, UH, FIELD IS GOING TO BE EXCAVATED. AND THE, UH, NARROW, UH, PATHWAY TO THE CREEK IS WHERE, UH, THE WATER WILL, THE, THE TIDAL WATER WILL BE COMING UP BACK AND FORTH THROUGH TO THE WETLANDS THAT ARE BEING CREATED. HERE IS A MORE DETAILED VIEW OF EXACTLY WHERE THE, I GUESS YOU'D CALL 'EM IN FALLS AND OUTFALLS WILL BE ONTO THE CREEK. AND THIS IS A DETAIL OF THE VARIOUS WETLAND IMPACTS. UM, OBVIOUSLY IT'S A LOT OF, UH, VERY SMALL IMPACTS AROUND THE ENTIRE PROJECT. AND I'LL HAVE THAT TABLE AT THE END OF THE PRESENTATION ALSO THAT YOU'LL BE ABLE TO READ. HERE ARE THE PICTURES, UH, THAT I TOOK. UM, THIS IS, UH, VIEW FACING NORTH INTO THE FIELD. UH, THAT'S GOING TO BE EXCAVATED. AND THIS IS JUST BACKING UP, UH, MAYBE 50 YARDS OR SO. UH, AGAIN, LOOKING AT THAT SAME FIELD. AND THIS IS, UH, TURNED AROUND LOOKING FROM THE VIEW OF THE FIELD, UH, TOWARDS THE CREEK. SO THIS ONE IS LOOKING SOUTHWARD AND YOU CAN SEE THE, UH, PINK FLAG, UM, UH, A FEW PINK FLAGS, UH, SHOWING THE PATHWAY, UH, THAT WILL BE FROM THE WETLANDS CREATED AND IN THE FIELD, UH, TO THE CREEK. AND THIS IS WILLOWDALE DRIVE. AGAIN, YOU CAN SEE THE PINK FLAG SHOWING THE PATHWAY. AND THIS IS JUST THREE VIEWS ONTO THE CREEK. THIS IS LOOKING, UH, TO THE SOUTHWEST, UH, TO THE SOUTH, AND THEN, UH, SOUTHEAST ONTO THE CREEK. RIGHT. LOOKS VERY FAMILIAR, DOESN'T IT, GENTLEMEN? AND THIS IS A VIEW FACING NORTH OF LOOKING BACK, UH, THE FIELD WOULD BE OFF TO THE UPPER RIGHT. UM, AND HERE ARE THE WETLANDS IMPACTS. IT'S, UH, 863 SQUARE FEET OF PERMANENT IMPACTS. OBVIOUSLY THERE ARE TEMPORARY IMPACTS AND CONVERSION. AND THE REQUEST HERE IS FOR, UH, THE COMPENSATION TO BE FROM THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT, WHICH PRESENTS A LITTLE BIT OF A LOGISTICAL PROBLEM AS TO HOW WE USUALLY HANDLE THESE. USUALLY YOU HAVE TO SHOW PROOF OF, UH, PAYMENT OR CREDITS GRANTED [00:30:01] OR APPLIED, UH, BEFORE THE WETLANDS PERMIT IS ISSUED. I DID, UH, SPEAK TO VMRC ABOUT THIS ISSUE AND HOW IT MAY BE HANDLED IN OTHER JURISDICTIONS, AND THEY SUGGESTED, THIS IS MY OWN LANGUAGE, BUT SUGGESTED LANGUAGE, UH, TO THIS EFFECT THAT WE WOULD GET A WRITTEN PLEDGE OF CREDITS FOR THE ISSUANCE OF THE PERMIT, AND THEN WITHIN 30 DAYS OF THE COMPLETION OF THE PROJECT, WE WOULD GET PROOF THAT THESE CREDITS WERE ACTUALLY APPLIED. YES, SIR. ALRIGHT. AND, UH, THAT'S MY PRESENTATION IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, GENTLEMEN, DO YOU HAVE ANY PICTURES OF THE P OF THE, OF THE P UH, AREAS? THE, UH, PRESSURE NON-TITLE AREAS THAT ARE CONVERTING, UM, THAT NEED TO BE MITIGATED FOR? I SEEN THIS HIGHLAND. SO, UM, WE'RE CONVERTING P TO, UH, THE COMMONING TO THE P THAT'S, THAT'S A, A NON-TITLE OR, OR NON-TITLE. YES, IT'S LIKE A PALM, YES. WHERE ARE YOU GUYS PICTURES OF PONDS THAT ARE, ARE, ARE CONVERTING? UH, THERE IS AN AREA I BELIEVE, UM, IT'S HARD TO SEE, BUT IT'S AN AREA, LEMME SEE, THERE'S LIKE THREE POOLS, ONE ACRE. UM, SO OBVIOUSLY THIS IS GONNA BE EXCAVATED. UM, HERE IS THE PATHWAY THAT THE WATER WILL FLOW, THE TIDAL WATER WILL FLOW. UM, THIS AREA IN HERE, UH, UM, IS WETLANDS, UH, BUT DOES APPEAR TO BE, UH, PROBABLY THE AREA THAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO OF, UH, FRESHWATER. FRESHWATER ON, ON THIS SIDE OF THE ROAD. UM, AND OBVIOUSLY THIS IS THE CREEK, UH, AND THE OUTFALLS HERE AND HERE, WHICH ARE CONNECTING TO THE, UH, THE ACTUAL TIDAL WATERS. AND IT'S A DIFFERENT MEDIC MITIGATION OF FRESHWATER NON-TITLE, I DUNNO, LIKE A DOLLAR 80 SOMETHING OR A TWO 40 SOMETHING COMPARED TO 18 HOURS. YES. SO THE MITIGATION'S NOT LIKE THE $18. THEY'RE, THEY'RE PAYING THE DOLLAR SOMETHING OR TWO, $2 OR SOMETHING TO MAKE IT, UM, A VEGETATED WETLAND. KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? THEY CONVERTING PEM, WHICH IS FRESH FOR NON-TITLE TO HYLAND. THEY CONVERT THAT TO TO, TO, UH, WETLAND, IF THAT'S WHAT, IF I'M READING IT RIGHT. WELL, I, IF I'M UNDERSTANDING CORRECTLY, UH, WELL OBVIOUSLY THIS, THIS PATHWAY, UH, THIS ENTIRE AREA IS, IS HIGHLANDS BEING CONVERTED TO THE, UH, WETLANDS? I THINK WE CAN GET THESE QUESTIONS ANSWERED. JUST A MOMENT. IF YOU'LL JUST GIVE US JUST A SECOND, UH, ANYONE THAT WISHES TO SPEAK OR ANSWER QUESTIONS, MAY I SWEAR YOU IN SIR? SIR? YES SIR. WOULD YOU STATE YOUR NAME FOR THE RECORD? MY NAME IS ROBIN BEDENBAUGH. I'M WITH RESOURCE ENVIRONMENTAL SOLUTIONS. SIR, DO YOU FIRM OR SWEAR YOU TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH IN ALL MATTERS BEFORE THIS BOARD? I THANK YOU. I THINK HE CAN ANSWER YOUR QUESTION. SO, UM, A LITTLE CORRECTION. THE, THE SQUARE IN THE FIELD IS WHERE THE SPOIL WE'RE GONNA, WE'RE GONNA BE DREDGE EXCAVATING IN THE YELLOW CROSS HATCHED AREAS IN THOSE PARTS OF THE FIELD. AND THEN WE'LL BE DISPOSING OF THAT MATERIAL IN THAT RECTANGULAR AREA. AND THAT, UH, PATH IS THE ROUTE THAT THE TRUCKS WILL TAKE TO, TO PLACE THAT MATERIAL. UM, THAT WILL BE, UH, RAISED TO APPROXIMATELY TWO FOOT ELEVATION WHEN WE PUT ALL THAT MATERIAL FROM THE EXCAVATED AREA. THE QUESTION ABOUT NON-TITLE WETLANDS, THE PURPLE HATCHED AREAS ARE CURRENTLY NON-TITLE WETLANDS. THOSE WILL BE MITIGATED SEPARATELY FROM THE TNCS, UM, SITE ON, ON ON ROUTE 13. I LIKE THAT. , UH, ANYONE ELSE? I, I CALL THAT . WELL, UH, JUST A QUICK QUESTION. GET ME LAY SOME MORE. SO CURIOSITY. SO THE ORANGE AREA IN TERMS OF TOTAL ACREAGE, WHAT DOES THE ORANGE, UH, AREA REPRESENT THEN? THAT'S THE ACTUAL AREA THAT WILL GENERATE MITIGATION, TITLE MITIGATION CREDITS. IT'S LIKE 5.7 ACRES OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. AND THEN THERE'S DIFFERENT CREDIT RATIOS THAT THE TABLE WE CAN'T QUITE READ, BUT THE, THE TOTAL, THE TOTAL AREA WILL GENERATE AROUND FIVE AND A HALF. FIVE AND A HALF. OKAY. CREDITS OF TITLE MITIGATION. VERY GOOD, THANK YOU. SO WHAT YOU COMPENSATE FOR PER AREA, YOU'RE TURNING FRESHWATER, UH, NON-TITLE TO VEGETATE. THE TITLE, TITLE . THAT'S, THAT'S CORRECT. GOT YOU. YEAH, WHICH IS A, A GOOD THING. UM, [00:35:01] ALRIGHT, ANYONE ELSE? UH, HANK YOU LOOKING CURIOUSLY? UH, I'M JUST, I'M, I'M OKAY. OKAY, THANK YOU SIR. THANK YOU. UM, IS THERE ANYONE ELSE HERE THAT WISHES TO SPEAK SPECIF SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR JPA, MR. WATSON, ANYTHING ELSE FROM YOUR END? I DID WANT TO ADD ONE OTHER THING ABOUT THIS LANGUAGE, UM, JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE, OR AT LEAST ALERT THE BOARD THAT, UM, THAT I PUT THE LANGUAGE IN HERE ABOUT, SINCE THIS PROJECT IS THE CREATION OF A WETLANDS MITIGATION BANK SPECIFICALLY, SO THAT OTHER APPLICANTS, UM, WOULD NOT, UM, TRY TO, UH, USE THIS METHOD OF, OF, OF, OF ISSUING THE PERMITS AND CREDITS BEING GRANTED LATER THAT THIS IS, UH, SPECIFIC TO THIS TYPE OF PROJECT, THE CREATION OF A WETLANDS MITIGATION BANK. BECAUSE I, IT COULD BE PROBLEMATIC IF OTHERS THINK THIS IS SOME TYPE OF, UH, GENERAL PRECEDENT THAT THE BOARD HAS SET. EVERYBODY UNDERSTAND THAT? 'CAUSE I, I DIDN'T, I WASN'T SURE. THANK YOU MR. WATSON. ALRIGHT. UM, ANYONE ELSE SPECIFICALLY SPEAKING ABOUT THIS PROJECT? IF NOT, I'D LIKE TO CLOSE THE FLOOR, OPEN IT TO PUBLIC COMMENT. NO PUBLIC COMMENT, MR. HAMID. ALRIGHT SIR, WE'LL, UH, CLOSE THE FLOOR. WE'RE GONNA OPEN IT NOW TO THE BOARD DISCUSSION. I THINK A LOT OF THE QUESTIONS HAVE BEEN ANSWERED, BUT, UH, GET 'EM ANSWERED AGAIN, IF YOU'RE NOT POSITIVE, WELL JUST MAKE, MAKE SURE THE 863 63 SQUARE FEET, UH, IS THERE A DIVISION BETWEEN NON VEGETATIVE AND VEGETATIVE OR IS THAT ALL VEGETATED OR, BECAUSE WE LIKE TO KEEP, YOU KNOW, A RECORD OF HOW MUCH IS WHAT'S DONE THERE. OKAY, THANK YOU SIR. YES, THE, THE IMPACTS, THE PERMANENT IMPACTS ARE VEGETATED AND THEY'RE PRIMARILY ALONG THE ROAD. IT'S NOT ACTUALLY PART OF THE MITIGATION BANK ITSELF. IT'S A CONCESSION TO THE LANDOWNER TO RAISE THE ELEVATION OF HIS ROAD TO HELP MINIMIZE TIDAL FLOODING INTO HIS FIELDS ON THE NORTH SIDE OF THE ROAD. AND WE'RE GONNA BE ADDING A THIRD CULVERT UNDER THERE TO HELP WITH DRAINAGE DURING STORM EVENTS. UM, AND BECAUSE WHEN WE ELEVATE THE ROAD, WE'LL WIDEN THE FOOTPRINT A LITTLE BIT 'CAUSE OF THE THREE TO ONE SLOPES FROM THE SIDE SLIPS OF THE ROAD. SO THE 8 6 3 IS JUST PURELY VEGETATED WETLANDS. PURELY VEGETATED. YEAH. AND JUST A CURIOSITY, AND THERE'S A, IF YOU MAY OR MAY NOT KNOW THIS, WHEN THERE'S A KING TIDE IN THE AREA, THIS, WHERE DOES, HOW FAR UP DOES THAT THING GO? WE, WE HAVE, WE HAVE PHOTOGRAPHS THAT, UM, THE ABUNDANCES HAVE TAKEN AND THAT ABOUT A 300 FOOT STRETCH OF ROAD AROUND EITHER SIDE OF THOSE CULVERTS THAT ARE EXISTING IS COMPLETELY UNDERWATER. OKAY. AND IT DOESN'T GO SO FAR INTO THE FIELD, IT'S, IT JUST STAYS DOWN BY, STAYS PRETTY, PRETTY CLOSE. YEAH. OKAY. YEAH. MM-HMM . ALRIGHT. PERFECT. THANK YOU. IF YOU WILL REMEMBER WE WENT THROUGH SOMETHING SIMILAR IN THIS AND EVERYBODY WENT DOWN AND LOOKED AT THE ISSUES AS, AS, UH, THAT PARTICULAR JPA, UH, WAS GOING TO AFFECT THE MATCHUP PUNGO RIVER AND WE HAD AT LEAST EIGHT SPEAKERS TALKING ABOUT HOW UH, IT AFFECTS THEIR DRIVEWAYS, THEIR YARDS, ET CETERA, ET CETERA. SO I THINK THIS IS A VERY GOOD THING AND I THINK IT'S GONNA BE GREAT FOR THAT AREA. UH, MR. WARD, IT'S IN YOUR BACKYARD. UH, ANYTHING YOU'D LIKE TO ASK OR? NO, NOT REALLY. UH, IT'S COMPLICATED, BUT I MADE CLEAR, I THINK IT'S PERFECTLY CLEAR TO ME. UH, MR. GER. YEAH, I, I I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THIS IS GONNA BE USED FOR THE PUBLIC TOO. IT'S JUST NOT NATURE CONSERVANCY PROJECTS, IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT. IT'S FOR THE VAR DIFF PROGRAM. SO IT WILL BE USED FOR CREDITS THAT ANYONE NEEDS, YOU KNOW? YEAH. GOOD. SO WE'LL BE COMING, THEY WILL BE COMING TO YOU OR THE NATURE CONSERVANCY? NATURE CONSERVANCY FIRST. YEP. YES. YEP. UNLESS THAT'S ANOTHER BANK. . YEP. RIGHT. OKAY. ALRIGHT. SO YOU, NATURE'S CONSERVANCY WILL BE SELLING CREDITS, THAT'S CORRECT. YEP. TO ANYBODY THAT HAS A WARRANT THAT, THAT GETS A PERMIT APPROVED. YES, YES. YEAH, DEFINITELY IS. YEAH. WELL I GUESS THAT'S ALWAYS AN IMPORTANT QUESTION. I MEAN, THIS IS THE FIRST, I THINK, TITLE WETLANDS BANK IN AKIMA COUNTY. IS THIS DESIGNATED EXCLUSIVELY FOR AKIMA COUNTY OR WILL ANYBODY ON THE EASTERN SHORE OR ANYWHERE ON THE WESTERN SHORE? WHAT IS THE DIVISION? THE SERVICE AREA, OFFICIAL SERVICE AREA IS THE ATLANTIC OCEAN BASIN AT HUCK. [00:40:01] SO ANYWHERE ALONG THE EASTERN SHORE OF VIRGINIA IS ELIGIBLE FOR USE OF THE BANK. THAT'S GOOD. YEP. YES, SIR. UM, ANYTHING ELSE? YES, A QUESTION LIKE I SAID, YES SIR. THINGS THEY CLOSE. IF YOU GOT PEOPLE HERE THAT PRESENT, UM, WE CHARGE $18 PER FOOT. WHAT, WHAT, WHAT IS, WHAT IS, UH, SERVICE CITY OR VIRGINIA QUA TRUST FUND CHARGE? UH, THEY HAVE JUST RECENTLY INCREASED THEIR, UM, FEE TO, UH, $1 MILLION PER ACRE. SO WHEN YOU DIVIDE THAT OUT BY 50 3004 5 45 60? YEAH. 45 60. UM, I THINK IT PROBABLY COMES OUT AROUND 22 OR $3, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. I'M NOT SURE. AND I'M NOT GONNA LIE, NOBODY, I KNOW YOU HERE THIS ONE, BUT THE, THE, THE PRICE THAT THAT BUMP FOR NOT A BUMP ON. 'CAUSE PEOPLE, THEY'RE, THE ONLY TIME THEY'RE DOING IT IS WHEN THEY HAVE TO DO IT. THAT'S, THAT'S THE REASON, LIKE I SAID, WHEN WE, WE INCREASED HOURS THAT WAY IT ONLY GETS DONE. JUST DON'T, JUST WILLY NILLY WANT TO DO SOMETHING. YOU REALLY, REALLY HAD THE NEED BEFORE YOU DO IT. AND THEN THAT YOU SAID IT'S 22. WHAT? I THINK I, I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT BUT 22 SOMETHING THAT'S 1 MILLION PER ACRE. SO 23 5 60 SQUARE FEET, IT'S 22 SOMETHING. AND THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S STILL IN THE SAME $18, $22. THAT'S, AND THE, THE BENEFIT I GUESS OF THIS IS THAT THESE, UH, CREDITS WILL BE ALREADY GENERATED. THE, THE MARSH WILL BE IN PLACE. SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE BUYING CREDIT. AND THEN, AND THEN MY NEXT QUESTION, QUESTION IS LIKE YOU SAY, I MEAN YOU TALK ABOUT VIRGINIA AQUA PLUS FUND OR NATION CONSERVANCY, IT'S LIKE WE JUST HAD A BIG PROJECT WITH THE, THE BRIDGE ONE, ONE THING. WOULD YOU ALL HAVE ENOUGH CREDITS TO DO THAT? IF IF, IF THAT WAS THE CASE THAT IF THEY NEEDED IT WAS JUST A COUPLE MONTHS AGO? YES. IF THEY NEEDED. DO Y'ALL HAVE ENOUGH CREDITS TO TAKE CARE OF A PROJECT LIKE THAT? IT DEPENDS. I MEAN, A LOT WHEN, USUALLY WHEN THE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT STATEMENTS ARE DONE FOR THESE PROJECTS, LIKE THE BRIDGE, LIKE THE NASA BRIDGE WAS PREDICTED TO HAVE 12 ACRES OF IMPACT. UM, BUT WHEN YOU GET DOWN INTO ALL THE DESIGN EXEMPTIONS AND STUFF AND FINAL DESIGN, USUALLY THAT SHRINKS AND IT MIGHT GO DOWN TO TWO ACRES. YOU KNOW, IN THAT CASE THERE, THERE WOULD BE CREDITS AVAILABLE, BUT THERE, THERE'S NOT 12 CREDITS. WELL, WHY I'M ASKING. I KNOW THAT WE READ THE RED VIRGINIA AQUA TRUST FUND WAS PRESENTED AS THE MITIGATION FOR THAT, AND THEN WE GET HERE. IT WASN'T, THAT'S WHY, THAT'S REALLY WHY THE QUESTION WELL, THAT SEE VIRGINIA RESOURCE TRUST FUND IS ALLOWED TO SOMETIMES SELL CREDITS IN ADVANCE AND THEN USE THAT MONEY TO ACTUALLY BUILD THE I CAN I GET THAT TOO. I GET THAT TOO. OKAY. ALRIGHT. ANYONE ELSE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? MS. JONES? THANK YOU. I THINK YOU'VE THANK YOU. US WELL DID IT IN ADVANCE. SO THAT'S, THAT'S, I GET THAT. I DON'T THINK MS. GORMAN HAS, UH, MUCH TO OFFER ON THIS PARTICULAR THING, BUT ANY QUESTIONS FOR HER? OKAY. UH, WELL JUST QUICK, I, I GUESS MAYBE, UH, IN TERMS OF MONITORING, I DON'T KNOW IF WE NEED A MONITORING PLAN FOR THIS OR NOT, OR IN THE FUTURE OR HOW'S THAT GOING TO WORK? MAYBE? OKAY. I DON'T THINK THAT'S A QUESTION FOR ME. UM, I THINK THE AGENT WOULD BE BETTER SUITED. OKAY. I'M SORRY. I SHOULD THANK, SORRY. YOU UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION, SIR? YES, SIR, I DO. YEP. UM, YES, AS PART OF THE BANKING AGREEMENT IS IT HAS TO BE MONITORED FOR 10 YEARS, SO WE WILL BE DOING THAT MONITORING. SO WE'RE NOT GOING, WE DON'T NEED TO WORRY ABOUT LOOKING AT THE MONITORING PLAN THAT'S GONNA BE TAKEN CARE OF. IT'S COVERED UNDER, YES, UNDER THE, THE SITE DEVELOPMENT PLAN THAT'S BEEN APPROVED OR IN THE PROCESS OF THE FINAL APPROVALS FROM THE AGENCIES HAS THE MONITORING PLAN IN IT AND, AND THE MONITORING PLAN IS CONTINUOUS. IS IT, UH, ANNUALLY? YES. YEP. WHAT? YES, IT'S, IT'S ANNUAL. ANNUAL FOR 10 YEARS. YEP. EVERYBODY GOT THAT? IS EVERYBODY OKAY? NO OFFENSE. IT'S NATURE CONSERVANCY. THEY MOVE, THEY EAT, THEY DRINK THIS . SO THAT'S NOT A PROBLEM. BUT I THINK IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT A PROBLEM. I THINK I HAD TO ASK THE QUESTION BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE WE, I THINK, THINK IT'S A GREAT PROJECT AND WE'RE SO GLAD YOU ARE. I AM SO GLAD THAT YOU ARE TAKING THIS ON, FRANKLY. THANK YOU, SIR. IS THERE A LIFE EXPECTANCY OF THIS PROPERTY? I, IT, IT IS PROTECTED IN PERPETUITY THROUGH A CONSERVATION EASEMENT? NO, I MEAN THE CREDITS, THE CREDITS ARE AVAILABLE. HOW LONG DO YOU THINK THE CREDIT WOULD GONE BE THERE? IF SOME OF THIS STUFF DEVELOPMENT GOES ON AT WALL ISLAND, THEY COULD BE GONE. IT'S QUICK. AS LONG AS IT'S GONE UNTIL IT'S GONE, THAT'S THE END. YEAH. RIGHT. YEAH. I JUST LIKE TO SEE IT LAST HALF A LIFE EXPECTANCY OF, I DON'T KNOW, A BIGGER PROJECT. GUESS IF, IF WE WENT ON HISTORIC DEMAND HERE ON THE EASTERN SHORE FOR TITLE CREDITS, IT, IT MIGHT BE 10 YEARS BEFORE IT'S USED, BUT THEN YOU GET ONE USER LIKE WALLOPS ISLAND THAT COULD, CAN CLEAN IT OUT. THAT'S THE WAY IT IS. YEAH. YEAH. JUST HAVE LIKE, IT'S [00:45:01] BEEN IN OTHER STATES AND OTHER PLACES DOWN THE COUNTY. UH, SAME, SAME SITUATION. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? ALRIGHT, UM, I'D LIKE TO ASK SOMEONE TO MAKE A MOTION, I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO MR. WARD THAT WE ACCEPT THE APPLICATION AS PRESENTED APPLICATION JPA 20 25 0 4 91. I GUESS THAT'S RULE THAT THAT'S ALL THERE IS IN A SECOND, PLEASE. WELL, I WOULD JUST MAYBE ADD THAT THE 863 SQUARE FEET WILL BE MITIGATED WITH, UH, UH, FORMATION OF ADDITIONAL WEAPONS. OKAY. GOT THAT JULIE? ALRIGHT. AND A SECOND. I'LL SECOND THAT. THANK YOU, SIR. UH, YES SIR. PLEASE SAY IT. UM, THE WITNESS. YEAH, IF YOU'RE MAKING THE MOTION TO APPROVE, I WOULD ASK THAT THE BOARD CONSIDER, UH, EXPLICITLY PUTTING THAT LANGUAGE IN THERE. ALRIGHT. CAN YOU SEE THAT? WELL, I ASSUMED IT WOULD BE IN THERE. UM, I I'M NOT EXACTLY SURE HOW YOU WANT TO DO IT. YOU CAN REFER TO IT OR READ IT. UH, HOWEVER YOU WANT TO HANDLE IT IS FINE. I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE ON THE RECORD IF YOU'D ALLOW ME, THIS IS STILL MR. WARD'S BUT, UH, THE SUGGESTED LANGUAGE FOR THE COMPENSATION, UH, SINCE THE PROJECT IS THE CREATION OF, UH, WETLANDS MITIGATION BANK, THE APPLICATION WILL COMPENSATE FOR THE LOSS OF 863 SQUARE FEET THAT'S ALREADY IN THE MOTION, UM, CREATED BY THE PROJECT AS FOLLOWS IN ONE AND TWO. SO IF WE MIGHT ADD THAT INTO THE MOTION. SORRY SIR. I NO PROBLEM. ALRIGHT, SIR. UH, NOW I MAY ASK FOR A SECOND. I'LL SECOND THAT SECOND AND A VOTE PLEASE. AYE. ALRIGHT. IT'S IN THE BOOK. UH, I, I ASSUME EVERYONE KNOWS THIS, BUT IT IS A TWO YEAR PERMIT AND OBVIOUSLY, UH, YOU CAN'T BOTHER ANYBODY ELSE'S LAND. . ALRIGHT, THAT IS IN THE BOOK. UH, SO IF WE MIGHT MOVE ON TO ITEM FIVE, OLD BUSINESS 5.01. THE JPA IS UH, 2 0 2 3 DASH 6 5 7. THIS IS, UH, INVOLVES A B, UM, MR. RAYMOND BRITTON, A VIOLATION. THAT WAS, UH, SOME TIME AGO AND WE HAVE BEAT THIS TO DEATH. AND SO, UH, FIRST THING I'M GONNA DO IS ASK MR. WATSON IF YOU WOULD JUST, UH, GO THROUGH WHAT YOU KNOW, UH, EVEN WHAT WE'VE DONE IN THE PAST JUST TO GET IT ON THE BOOK, PLEASE. SO HERE IS THE ORIGINAL PLAN THAT WAS SUBMITTED, UH, FOR THIS BULKHEAD. UM, UH, VIC INC. MR. BRITTON WAS BROUGHT BACK BEFORE THE BOARD IN ORDER TO COMPLY WITH THIS PLAN. AND THE BOARD ASSESSED A WETLANDS MITIGATION FEE FOR THE WETLANDS, UH, THAT WERE AFFECTED BY THE FACT HE DID NOT BUILD, ACCORDING TO THIS PLAN, UH, THAT FEE HAS BEEN PAID. UM, I WOULD SAY THAT, UH, JUST BECAUSE YOU PAY A WETLANDS MITIGATION FEE DOES THEN NOT GIVE YOU THE RIGHT TO PARTICULARLY BUILD ANYTHING ON TOP OF THOSE WETLANDS. IT'S TWO SEPARATE PRINCIPLES, BUILDING ACCORDING TO PLAN AND COMPENSATING FOR WETLANDS THAT YOU HAVE, UH, DESTROYED OR AFFECTED. UM, THERE WAS A CHECK OF THE BULKHEAD AFTER IT WAS ALTERED AND THE BULKHEAD AGAIN WAS NOT BUILT ACCORDING, UH, TO THIS PLAN. UM, IN PARTICULAR, UH, THE 38 FOOT SECTION HERE IS, UH, OVER 42 FEET LONG. AND, UM, MR. BRITTON HAS SUBMITTED AN AS-BUILT PLAN AND I'LL, I'M GONNA BE TOGGLING BACK AND FORTH BECAUSE THIS IS A, UH, CONFUSING SET OF PLANS, A CONFUSING SET OF CIRCUMSTANCES. I JUST WANNA SAY THAT UP FRONT. UM, AND THIS IS, UH, MR. BRIT'S AS-BUILT, UM, WITH MY ANNOTATIONS OF IN RED OF THE MEASUREMENTS [00:50:01] THAT I'VE TAKEN. I'VE BEEN TO THE SITE SEVERAL TIMES WAS YES, SIR. UH, THERE AGAIN ON FRIDAY. AND ONE THING I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT IS THE MOST CONFUSING ASPECT OF, OF THE ORIGINAL PLANS AND WHAT HAS BEEN BUILT IS THAT I HAVE CONCLUDED THAT THIS 50 FEET RIGHT HERE, THAT IS AN INCORRECT NUMBER. IT WAS INCORRECT FROM THE BEGINNING. AS YOU CAN SEE, UM, THERE'S SOMETHING HERE SAYS EXISTING BULKHEAD AND THE NEW BULKHEAD. SO THE NEW BULKHEAD WAS GONNA BE VERY CLOSE TO THAT 50 FOOT LINE, BUT AS YOU CAN SEE, UH, MR. BRITTON AND I BOTH, UH, AGREE THAT IT'S ABOUT EIGHT, SIX AND A HALF TO EIGHT FEET OF DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THAT SECTION AS BUILT. AND WHAT WAS ON THE ORIGINAL PLANS? UM, THE 38 FOOT SECTION ORIGINALLY WAS BUILT AT 55 FEET, HAS BEEN PULLED BACK TO ABOUT 42 AND A HALF FEET. YES, SIR. UM, MY MEASUREMENTS ARE A LITTLE DIFFERENT. MR. BRITTON'S, WE'RE NOT TOO FAR OFF, UH, WITHIN A FOOT OR SO OF EACH OTHER. IT SAY 42 AND 43 AND A HALF, IS THAT WHAT IT SAYS? YES, SIR. ALRIGHT, SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A FOOT AND A HALF HERE, IS THAT CORRECT? CORRECT. YES. ALRIGHT, PLEASE. UM, SO MY CONCLUSION AFTER, AND I'VE BEEN OUT THERE, UM, UH, FIVE TIMES NOW. I'M UP ON CHIN TEETH AND I USUALLY GO BY AND AS I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT WAS PROPOSED, WHAT HAS BEEN BUILT AND, AND, AND WHAT, UH, SHOULD HAVE BEEN PROPOSED AND BUILT IT, IT'S VERY CONFUSING. BUT THAT THIS MEASUREMENT, AS YOU CAN SEE, 88 7 MEASUREMENT FROM, THAT'S A MEASUREMENT FROM HERE TO HERE. SO THIS CORNER RIGHT HERE, WHICH IS THE CORNER THAT WAS PULLED BACK FROM 55 TO 42 6, UM, APPEARS TO BE IN THE RIGHT SPOT. THIS CORNER HERE IS NOT IN THE RIGHT SPOT ACCORDING TO THE ORIGINAL PLAN. AS YOU CAN SEE, THE ORIGINAL PLAN SAID 50 FEET, PULLED BACK, VERY SMALL AMOUNT. AND HERE WE ARE AT 42 AS MEASURED BY MR. BRITTON, 43 6 AS MEASURED BY ME. UM, WHILE THIS POINT TO THIS POINT IS 88 7 THAT I MEASURED HERE, YOU HAVE A 38 PLUS 50, ALRIGHT. ABOUT 88 FEET FROM HERE TO HERE. OKAY? SO, UM, THE REASON I WENT BACK IS DURING THE LAST HEARING, MR. BRITTON, UH, REPEATED SEVERAL TIMES THAT THE LENGTH APPEARS TO BE THE SAME FROM HIS ORIGINAL PLAN TO WHAT HAS NOW BEEN BUILT. OF COURSE, THAT MADE ME CURIOUS, UM, AS TO WHETHER THAT WAS CORRECT BECAUSE I WAS FOCUSED ON THE LENGTH OF THIS SECTION, WHICH SHOULD HAVE ONLY BEEN 38 FEET. SO ONCE I DETERMINED THAT FROM HERE TO HERE WAS APPROXIMATELY 88 FEET, GIVE OR TAKE A FEW INCHES, UM, THEN IT LED ME TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT THE ORIGINAL DRAWING, SEE THE DISCREPANCY FOR THIS SECTION, AND DETERMINE THAT THIS CORNER IS THE INCORRECT CORNER NOW. OKAY, I, I, AND I, I APOLOGIZE, I'M TRYING TO MAKE THIS AS CLEAR AS I CAN. I, I'VE FOUND IT VERY CONFUSING MYSELF. I'M HOPING THAT IT'S BEEN CLEAR. WE, WE ALL HAVE FOUND IT VERY CONFUSING. UH, BUT WE'RE GONNA GET TO THE BOTTOM OF IT AND THANK YOU FOR, UH, YOUR PART. UM, OBVIOUSLY, UM, MR. BRITTON, UH, OWNER, UH, BIC UH, KEEP YOUR SEAT SIR, BUT DO YOU MIND IF I SWEAR YOU IN? YEAH. YOU FIRMLY SWEAR YOU TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH IN ALL MATTERS BEFORE THIS BOARD. I DO. ALRIGHT, MR. BRITTON, EVEN WE HAVE A MICROPHONE, MR. IF YOU'D LIKE IT, YOU NEED IT? I CAN SPEAK UP. UH, YEAH, YELL AT US. BUT, UH, EVEN IF MR. WATSON HAS ALREADY BEEN THROUGH IT, WE'D LIKE TO HEAR IT BECAUSE WE WANT THIS TO GO AWAY AND, UH, I DO TOO. WELL, DON'T KEEP GOING. WHAT IF A COMMON SET WAS USED FOR THE COUNTY? THIS WOULD'VE BEEN GOING A LONG TIME AGO. YES SIR. IT'S NOT USED THOUGH. I'M SORRY. ALRIGHT, WHY DON'T YOU START AND SAY ANYTHING YOU WANT. SAY, I, HE JUST MADE A STATEMENT THAT, THAT THE TURN WALL, UH, IS NOT IN THE CORRECT SPOT. YES SIR. THERE IS NO THE SPOT IT COULD HAVE BEEN ACCORDING TO THE DRAWING, WE GOT PICTURES RIGHT HERE SHOWING A TWO FOOT OFFSET MEASURES FROM THE [00:55:01] SAME GOING OUT AND EVERYTHING. THE ONLY DISCREPANCY WAS THE FIGURE, THE NUMBERS ON THE WRONG, THE 50 FOOT AND THE 38 FOOT WERE WRONG. WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN 12 FOOT. THE MID, THE PART WE LEFT SHOULD HAVE BEEN 12 FOOT FOR THE SOUTH PROP LINE FIVE. NOW THE 15 FOOT SOMETHING. SO I'M GIVING UP A FOUR MORE FEET OF UPWARD. THE ENCROACHMENTS HASN'T CHANGED A BIT. THERE WERE TWO WRONG MEASUREMENTS AND THE CABIN'S WASTED A FOURTH RIDING BY FORTH TO LOOK AT IT. WELL THAT'S FOR ANOTHER DISCUSSION. WE CAN HAVE THAT ONE IN THE PARKING LOT, BUT WHAT WE CARE ABOUT SOMEBODY ELSE, SIR, WHAT IT WILL BE HAD THEN WITHOUT THE FUEL. YES SIR. BECAUSE I'M GONNA FILE COMPLAIN ABOUT SOME OF THIS STUFF. SO IF I MAY INTERJECT FOR A SECOND. ARE YOU, ARE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING HERE BECAUSE OF THE EYE ANGLE OF THIS PARTICULAR, THAT YOU DRAW THIS STRAIGHT DOWN, YOU'RE SAYING THAT'S TWO FEET RIGHT THERE? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? THAT'S WHAT THE, THERE'S A PICTURE SHOWING THAT TWO, THAT THE OLD WALK IN THERE, THE EVERY, SO IT'S THAT LITTLE BIT THERE, THERE ABOUT TWO FEET. YEAH. IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE, OKAY. ALRIGHT. THAT'S WHAT I WANNA TRY TO POINT OUT. DID EVERYONE UNDERSTAND THAT? YEAH, BECAUSE I HAD ISSUES AND CAN I HAVE, CAN I HAVE THE, THE ORIGINAL, OKAY, SO THAT'S 50. LEMME SEE THIS. 50 FOOT, IT'S SUPPOSED TO HAVE BEEN 50 FOOT ON THE ON THING. AND LIKE I SAID, IT WAS TWO WRONG REGIMENS. IT WAS DONE BEFORE THE SURVEY WAS DONE. THERE'S TWO WRONG MEASUREMENTS, RIGHT? THERE'S TWO WRONG MEASUREMENTS. YOU'RE RIGHT. I, AND EVERYBODY THAT'S, BUT I'M SAYING, BUT THIS IS EASY. YOU GOT 50 FOOT DOWN BELOW AND IN, IN, IN EXISTENCE. WHAT, 42 NOW'S 42. THAT'S FOUR TWO, BUT IT SUPPOSED TO BE 50. AM I RIGHT OR WRONG? THAT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE 50. IT SUPPOSED TO BE 50. SMOKEY HAD ORIGINAL DRAWING. 50. SO, OKAY, SO WE GOT THE 50 AND THEN THE OTHER ONE, THE OTHER ON THE OLD DRAWING IS 38, IS THAT CORRECT? 38, IT'S 88 FEET AND THEN WELL THEN TWO FOR OFFSET. SO IN THE REAL WORLD IT'S 90. THAT'S THAT'S RIGHT. SO IN THE REAL WORLD'S 90, I'M NOT HURTING YOU, I'M HELPING YOU. SO IN THE REAL WORLD, IN THE REAL WORLD, ON THE ORIGINAL, ON THE ORIGINAL THING RIGHT THERE ON THE ORIGINAL DIAGRAM, GROUND 50 38 AND THE TWO FOOT ALL SET IS 90 FOOT. RIGHT NOW YOU HAVE 80, 83, 4. IS THAT CORRECT? THE WHAT'S START RIGHT NOW? THAT'S RIGHT. WHAT IS, WHAT IS THE, WHAT IS WHAT'S THERE NOW WHAT'S THE ONE ACROSS FROM THAT POINT THERE TO THE CORNER? IT IS, UH, 83 FEET, 83 FOOT. OKAY. THAT'S, THAT'S ACCORDING TO MR. BRITTEN'S MEASUREMENTS. WHAT'S THE, WHAT'S THE MEASUREMENTS ON THE 88 7 88 7 STILL WE'RE STILL WE'RE STILL SAME THING. THE ORIGINAL HAD 90 FOOT ONE ACROSS. IS THAT, YOU SEE WHAT I'M SAYING? SURE. THE ORIGINAL'S 90 FOOT ONE ACROSS, EVEN THOUGH YOU GOT TWO WRONG MEASUREMENTS ON THERE, BUT IT'S TOTAL THE SAME. THE TOTAL, THAT TWO FOOT OFFSET IS 90 FOOT RIGHT NOW SAYING 88 7. THAT'S ALL I GOTTA SAY. MM-HMM . SO, WELL I PLEASE, OKAY, HOLD ON. JUNIOR. MR. BRITTON CAN TRY TO BLAME THIS ON STAFF. ALL HE WANTS THE BOTTOM LINE. WE'VE BEEN DEALING WITH MR. BRITTON'S DRAWINGS FOR 40 YEARS AND THEY'VE NEVER BEEN AS SATISFYING AS THEY NEED TO BE. UM, SO I, I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH PICKING ON STAFF FAR THE PROBLEM THAT MR. BRITTON BROUGHT UPON HIMSELF. UH, I I THINK YOU ARE EXACTLY RIGHT AND I COULDN'T, UH, BE MORE IN FAVOR OF, UH, NOT BLAMING OUR STAFF. NOW, UH, MR. BRITTON, YOU'VE BEEN IN THIS A LONG, LONG TIME AND YOU'VE BEEN ENOUGH OF THESE MEETINGS TO SEE THE DRAWINGS THAT PEOPLE BRING IN HERE AND WHAT WE SEE HERE. SO I THINK YOU'D EVEN HAVE TO ADMIT, BUT THEY ARE A LITTLE ELEMENTARY, IF YOU'LL ALLOW ME TO SAY THAT COMPARED TO, UH, SOMEONE THAT HAS DRAWN 'EM UP PROPERLY THAT HAS SAID THAT'S IT'S MOVE ON, PLEASE. YEAH, I AGREE. WE NEED TO, UM, DECIDE WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO, WHAT YOU FEEL WE SHOULD DO AND, UH, GET TO THE BOTTOM OF IT. AND WE WANT THIS GONE NOW. YES, SIR. MR. WATSON, UM, JUST WANTED TO SAY, UH, TWO THINGS. UM, IF THIS WASN'T CLEAR EARLIER, I PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE CONCLUDED WITH THIS, BUT I WOULD SAY THAT FOR THE, THESE ARE MR. BRITTON'S AS-BUILT, OF COURSE, OBVIOUSLY, JUST TO EMPHASIZE THIS WAS HIS PLAN, UH, FOR THE, AS-BUILT TO BE THE SAME AS THE ORIGINAL PLAN. THIS CORNER WOULD HAVE TO BE PULLED BACK SOMEWHERE, LIKE RIGHT HERE, UM, OBVIOUSLY TO SATISFY THE MEASUREMENTS ON THE PLAN THAT WAS APPROVED. OKAY. [01:00:01] UM, AND I WOULD JUST SAY THAT I, I HEARD MR. BRITTON SAY THAT THE PLAN WAS SUBMITTED, UH, BEFORE THE SURVEYOR CAME, BUT THESE ARE FOR THE MOST PART FAIRLY SIMPLE ANGLES AND MEASUREMENTS. UM, I I I JUST LEAVE IT AT THAT. UM, I HEAR YOU. UH, THIS IS WHAT EVERYONE IS LOOKING AT. THIS IS WHAT I'VE BEEN, UH, LOOKING AT UNTIL I, UH, NEED NEW GLASSES. UH, BUT LET'S, LET'S FORGET THE PAST. LET'S TALK ABOUT EXACTLY NOW. WHAT'S, WHAT CAN WE DO TO MAKE THIS GO AWAY NOW? INTERESTING. YOU MENTIONED YOU'RE GONNA PEEL IT ANYWAY, SO, UH, I DON'T GUESS IT MAKES A HOLE IN IT'S PROBABLY IS IT'S TOTAL FEE ACROSS THAT FRONT. HAS IT CHANGED TO WHAT THE ORIGINAL DRAWINGS IS? IT'S LESS NOW THE IMPACT OR EVEN LESS NOW. THEY WERE BEFORE, I'LL COME BACK TO THE SOUTH PROPERTY LINES ALMOST 16 FOOT WHERE IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN 12 FOOT. MM-HMM . I THINK IN, IN MY PERSONAL OPINION, IN THE, UH, WHAT IS BUILT IN THAT CORNER, WHICH IS NOT THE CORNER, BUT THE, THE ANGLE, UH, THE 42 FEET GOING OUT, UH, WHAT IS THAT, 13 FEET OUT? 14 FOOT DOWN 13. YEAH. I, I BELIEVE THAT CORNER'S PROBABLY IN THE PLACE THAT WE ALL AGREED IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN. NOW THE, THE MEASUREMENTS WERE PROBABLY, OR WHERE THEY WERE, THEY WERE INCORRECT. UH, BUT I THINK THE LOCATION IN THAT CORNER IS PROBABLY WHAT WE ALL THOUGHT IT SHOULD BE. I'VE GOT A PICTURE SHOWING WHERE THAT TURN, THE OLD OLD TURN WAS RIGHT HERE. MM-HMM . I'LL GIVE IT TO YOU WHERE THE NEW BULKHEAD BEING INSTALLED MM-HMM . SO IT WASN'T PUT IN THE WRONG SPOT. IT WAS PUT IN THE RIGHT SPOT. YOUR MEASUREMENTS WERE JUST OFF MEASURE FOR WRONG. YES. ADMITTED THAT I SEEN NEW MEASUREMENTS. MM-HMM . HAVE WE MEASURED THOSE THINGS A DOZEN TIMES FACE TO FACE MM-HMM . WHERE WE MEASURE A BULK, WE GO TWO FOOT IN FRONT OF ONE FACE TO FACE. MM-HMM . THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT THE FOUR, UH, 4 1 4 WAS AND THE FOUR TWO FEET FACE TO FACE. DO WE, DOES THIS HAVE TO HAVE A NEW APPLICATION OR, OR ARE WE GOOD AS A SO, UM, THINK CHANGE, SEVERAL MONTHS AGO WHEN I WAS TALKING TO MR. BRITTON ABOUT THIS, I ADVISED HIM THAT, YOU KNOW, WE NEEDED TO HAVE AN AS YOU KNOW, HE NEEDED TO SUBMIT AN AS BILL MM-HMM . BUT THAT I DIDN'T, I HAD NO IDEA HOW THAT WOULD BE HANDLED BY BMRC OR THIS BOARD. IT'S JUST THERE WASN'T MUCH WE COULD DO. AND WELL, IT WOULD MAKE IT A LOT EASIER IF HE COULD PRESENT US WITH WHAT HE BUILT AS OPPOSED TO WHAT WAS APPROVED. AND, UM, HE OF COURSE SUBMITTED THIS DRAWING A-B-M-R-C. I KNOW THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION THERE, WHETHER IT WAS AN AMENDMENT TO THE PRESENT PERMIT OR A NEW APPLICATION AND, UM, THE DECISION WAS MADE. IT WOULD BE AN AMENDMENT TO THIS PERMIT. OKAY. UM, AND I WOULD JUST SAY THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE SURE THAT WHAT'S BEEN PERMITTED IS BUILT AND, YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES INCHES MM-HMM . IT'S DIFFICULT TO SAY, UM, OR WOULD BE DIFFICULT TO HOLD SOMEBODY OR TO HAUL SOMEBODY BACK IN FRONT OF THE BOARD IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT SIX INCHES OR SO. BUT HERE IT'S, YOU KNOW, FOUR OR FIVE FEET DIFFERENT SPOTS. IT'S, IT MAKES IT DIFFICULT TO DETERMINE, UM, WHAT, WHAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO DO IF YOU'RE JUST NOT GONNA BUILD ACCORDING TO PLAN. YEAH. MM-HMM . ALRIGHT. COULD I HAVE MS. GORMAN? ABSOLUTELY. MS. GORMAN, WOULD YOU STEP UP? WE HAVE A QUESTION OR TWO IF YOU DON'T MIND. SURE. MS. GORMAN NOT, NOT, NOT, NOT GONNA STICK UP FOR STAFF, BUT THERE'S TOO LONG MEASUREMENTS HERE. AS A BOARD, WE DID APPROVE NON QUI BALL KIT ON THE FENCE. HOW MUCH AS THE ASBUILT, HOW MUCH MORE ENCROACHMENT TO THE BRCS PROPERTY IS THERE? SO AS THE ASBUILT? I BELIEVE SO THIS IS, THESE MEASUREMENTS ARE NEW TO ME. UM, THIS MAKES A LOT OF SENSE BASED ON WHAT HAPPENED, WHAT WAS SAID IN THE LAST HEARING. I THINK THIS IS STILL ABOUT TWO FEET OVER STATE, ON BOTTOM, OUTSIDE OF THE PERMIT, OUTSIDE OF WHAT WAS PERMITTED. AND THAT IS ON THAT SOUTH FACING BULKHEAD FROM WHAT I MEASURED MYSELF PREVIOUSLY. UM, AND THAT'S, YEAH. TWO, TWO FEET. IS THAT WHAT WE JUST HEARD APPROXIMATELY ON THAT SOUTH FACING BULK? BECAUSE WHAT WAS PERMITTED, THE MOST OPEN PORTION OF THIS WAS THAT SOUTHERN BULKHEAD, IT WAS COMPLETELY GONE. AND SO VMRC AND YOU ALL ISSUED PERMITS FOR BOTH CORRECT. FOR THAT ALIGNMENT. UM, AND THE TOTAL FRONTAGE WOULD'VE [01:05:01] BEEN 88 FEET THAT YOU PERMITTED. RIGHT. WE PERMITTED THAT SIDE TOO. SO THAT LINE HAS COME BACK NORTH, FOUR MORE FEET TO INSTEAD OF BEING 12 FOOT, THE PROPERTY LINE, IT'S NOW ALMOST 16 FOOT. SO YOU GAIN FOUR MORE FOOT BOTTOM. WELL THERE'S WETLANDS THERE TOO, SO IT'S NOT ALL, NOT ALL STATE UP BOTTOM. WELL, 12 FOOTBALL WAS BEHIND THE WETLANDS AND I LEFT THAT THERE WHEN YOU PULLED IT BACK AND IN THE FRONT, Y'ALL PULLED ME BACK OUT. SIX FOOT, SIX, SEVEN FOOT. IT STAYED THERE ABOUT A MONTH. IT WAS GONE. 2, 2 50 OLD BALL CAME OUT. IT WAS GONE. I DO HAVE TO SAY, YOU CAN SEE, EXCUSE ME SIR, YOU GET YOUR CHANCE. UM, AND YOU, YOU WILL. ALRIGHT. I DO HAVE TO SAY THAT SINCE, UM, THIS WAS NOT CONSTRUCTED IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE PERMIT AND THEN IT WAS REVISED, IT'S VERY, VERY DIFFICULT TO DETERMINE WHAT IS STILL, UM, AN ISSUE. SO THESE ARE OUR BEST ESTIMATES AND IT JUST BECOMES VERY COMPLICATED WHEN YOU HAVE MULTIPLE, YOU AGREE THAT THE EROSION IN THAT AREA ON THAT SOUTH END IS, IT'S, IT'S HORRIBLE. WE, WE KNOW THAT. WELL, THERE'S JUST TO PERMIT MEAN, JUST DON'T WANT TO PROBLEM PROCESS IT. LIKE, LIKE I WAS SHOCKED WHEN I WENT THERE. I WAS SHOCKED WHEN I WENT THERE FOR A VIOLATION. MM-HMM . SEE HOW MUCH IT HAD. WELL, CERTAINLY ONCE YOU DISTURB WETLANDS, THEY DON'T, IT WON'T LAST. SURE. NO, I MEAN, WAY FURTHER THAN IT ALL THE WAY DOWN. ALL THE WAY DOWN. I MEAN, NOT JUST IN THAT AREA, I MEAN ALL THE WAY DOWN. LIKE I SAID, IT WON'T COME IN THIS, THAT, THAT, THAT MARSH IS RECEIVING. MM MM-HMM . ALRIGHT. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR HER? JUST SO I'M CLEAR, ALTHOUGH IT'S NOT NECESSARILY JURISDICTION, IS THERE GONNA BE A SECONDARY PARK TO THIS AMENDMENT? BECAUSE THERE MAY BE SOME STATE LAND, UH, UNDERNEATH THE, UH, MEAN LOW WATER. IS THAT A I CAN'T ANSWER THAT. OKAY. YOU CAN'T OKAY. ALRIGHT. UH, ANYONE ELSE? JUST, YES. YOU KNOW, TO ME, I HONESTLY BELIEVE THAT IT IS BUILT ACCORDING TO WHAT WE THOUGHT IT SHOULD BE. OKAY. NOW THE NUMBERS WERE OFF. IT'S NO QUESTION ABOUT THE NUMBERS BEING OFF, BUT I REALLY BELIEVE NOW IT'S WHERE IT'S WAS INTENDED TO BE VERY CLOSE. AND I AGREE WITH THAT. IF YOU DON'T MIND, MA'AM, DON'T, DON'T LEAVE US. UM, MR. BRITTON, YOU'RE SWORN IN, SO JUST, JUST HAVE A SEAT. UH, THIS YOUNG MAN WISHES TO SPEAK. I DIDN'T HAVE NO, NO, NO. OKAY. UH, THAT'S FINE. UH, SO I AGREE. UH, IT'S BUILT, EVEN THOUGH THE NUMBERS ARE OFF, IT'S, IT'S BUILT GENERALLY EXACTLY THAT. SO WE'VE GOTTA DETERMINE, UM, WHAT WE ARE GONNA BE RESPONSIBLE FOR. AND WE'VE ALREADY HEARD FROM MR. WATSON THAT IT WAS, UH, AN ADDENDUM TO THE ORIGINAL PERMIT. THEREFORE, THERE IS NOT A NEW PERMIT NECESSARILY. UH, SO THAT'S WHAT I HEARD. YES, SIR. OKAY. IT, IT, IT, UH, A-B-M-R-C PROCESSED IT AS YES. AS AN AMENDMENT THAT'S OUT OF OUR HANDS. SO, UH, KNOWING THAT, UH, THE MRC, UM, WE ARE ONLY RESPONSIBLE FOR, UH, VEG, NON VEG IN OUR, SO, UM, SO MR. CHAIR, JUST TO CLARIFY, IT'S THE REBUILT WALL THAT'S BEEN PULLED BACK THAT'S CLOSE TO AN APPROXIMATION OF WHAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUILT AFTER WE, AFTER IT'S BEEN PULLED BACK AND REBUILT. CORRECT. WELL, FURTHER BACK NOW. YES, MA'AM, PLEASE. I JUST WANT, I JUST WANT TO BE VERY CLEAR THAT THIS WAS SUBMITTED UNDER THE SAME PERMIT NUMBER, BUT THE PERMIT HAS NOT BEEN REVISED. THIS IS JUST A REVISION THAT WAS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT. IT IS IN THAT FILE, BUT THE PERMIT HAS NOT BEEN MODIFIED. WE SUBMITTED TO YOU TOO, OR, OR? YES. IT'S, IT'S IN THE FILE. OKAY. IT'S IN THE FILE, YES. BUT IT, THE PERMIT ITSELF, I THINK SHE'S AGREEING WITH IT HAS NOT CHANGED. IT'S ALL IN THE SAME FILE. IT HASN'T CHANGED. OKAY. YES, WE DID PROCEED THAT. SO, UH, WE, WE NEED TO THANK YOU, MA'AM. UH, WE NEED TO HAVE THIS GOING RIGHT NOW. MM-HMM . SO WE NEED TO DETERMINE, UM, WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN, WHAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN, UH, AND RIGHT HERE WITH MR. BRITTON, WHAT HE'S WILLING TO DO, AND I'M GONNA LEAVE IT UP TO YOU. MY FIRST QUESTION IS, DO WE NEED TO ADVISE PERMIT, UM, ARE YOU SATISFIED WITH DRAWING ON THE OLD PERMIT HAS BEEN APPROVED, OR DO WE NEED TO ADVISE PERMIT? THAT'S MY MAIN QUESTION. YOU, YOU SAID NO, DID YOU NOT MR. WATSON? WELL, I, WELL, I WOULD, [01:10:01] WELL, MR. BRITTON HAS FILED THIS WITH BMRC AND THIS DRAWING MINUS MY RED ANNOTATIONS IS IN VRCS FILE. UM, UH, THIS DRAWING IS OF COURSE BEFORE THIS BOARD RIGHT NOW. UM, AND, BUT I THINK A SECOND QUESTION, MAYBE WHAT YOU'RE GETTING AT IS WHETHER OR NOT I AGREE WITH THESE NUMBERS. UM, AND, AND I, AND I, AND I DON'T, I I HAVE ACTUALLY TALKED TO MR. BRITTON ABOUT TRYING TO GET HIM TO PUT THESE NUMBERS ON HIS REVISED PLAN. UM, HE DIDN'T WANT TO DO THAT. SO, I MEAN, WE DON'T HAVE A BIG DIFFERENCE HERE, BUT, UH, IT WHAT ARE, WHAT ARE YOUR NUMBERS FOR THE FRONT BULKHEAD? THE FULL FRONT BULKHEAD, UM, 88 FEET, SEVEN INCHES. OKAY. AND LIKE I SAID, WE APPROVED NINE ORIGINALLY. I KNOW, AND I KNOW HE ADMITS IT. HE'S SITTING RIGHT THERE. TWO WRONG MEASUREMENTS. THAT'S WHAT THE WHOLE THING IS. IT'S NOT STAFF PLEASE. IT'S NOT STAFF. TWO WRONG MEASUREMENTS. HE SITTING RIGHT THERE ADMITTING IT. SO WE APPROVED 90 FOOT AND LIKE I SAID, THE MITIGATION, LIKE I SAID, I KNOW IT'S NOT A THING. LIKE I SAID, I'M DONE THE MITIGATION BECAUSE I, I KNEW IT WASN'T GONNA GROW THERE BECAUSE OF THE, THE LOSS IN THAT AREA ALREADY. SO THAT'S NOT THE REASON I DID DID THAT. 'CAUSE I KNEW WHATEVER YOU PLANT THERE IS NOT GONNA GROW UP. YOU JUST WAST YOUR TIME'S. WHY I MADE YOU PAY FOR IT. SO THAT'S NOT THE REASON. IT'S NOT EXCUSE EITHER FOR A, ANOTHER PROJECT YOU BROUGHT A PAID FOR THE THING AND YOU JUST GO ENCROACH ON. NO, BUT WE ORIGINALLY PROVED N SO, AND LIKE I SAY, THE ONLY THING THAT'S DIFFERENT ME THAT IT'S OUT OF OUR HANDS ANYWAY, THE ENCROACHMENT ON VMRC, THAT'S, THAT'S THEM. I'LL GUARANTEE YOU. THEY'LL, THEY'LL TAKE CARE OF IT. ORIGINALLY THERE WAS NO MITIGATION FEES. I WAS BEHIND THE WETLANDS, 12 FOOT FOR THE PROPERTY LINE PLACE PUT BE BEHIND THE VEGETATED WETLAND. WE PULLED THE FRONT WALL BACK. IT WASN'T WAS 38 FOOT SUPPOSED TO, WE PULLED THAT BACK ABOUT SEVEN FOOT, GOT BEHIND THE WETLANDS WITH IT AND WE LEFT THE WETLANDS. WE PULLED THE OLD BULKHEAD OUT IN THE FRONT. MONTHS LATER IT'S GONE. YES, SIR. SOUTH SIDE, THERE WAS NO LITIGATION FEES BECAUSE WE WERE 12 FOOT TO THE PROP LINE BEHIND THE VEGETATION. NOW PAGE 1900 BOTTLE FOR I DON'T KNOW WHAT FOR YET. AND I'M FOUR FOOT FURTHER NOW, SO I'M GIVING YOU FOUR FOOT MORE OF, UH, CBAS BOTTOM ON THE SOUTH SIDE. MAN. HOW MUCH WILL YOU WANT? WELL, LET'S REVIEW THIS ONE, MR. BRIT. WAS IT THE FACT THAT YOU BUILT THE INITIAL WALL ON THE SOUTH SIDE? IN FRONT IN THE WRONG SPOT? IN THE WRONG SPOT. SO THE MITIGATION FEE WAS THAT? YEP. THAT WAS A SOUTH WALL. ON FRONT WALL. MM-HMM. RIGHT. OKAY. THAT'S RIGHT. SOUTH WALL. OKAY. JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE WERE CLEAR ON THAT. THAT'S, YEAH, IT WAS MITIGATION. WASN'T THE SOUTH WAS IT WAS SOUTH MITIGATION WAS SOUTH MITIGATION THE SOUTH MITIGATION THE SOUTH WAS FROM THE SOUTH. YEAH, SOUTH ELMONT. IT WAS OVER THE SOUTH SIDE. WE HAD, WE YES SIR, WENT WHEN I DISCOVERED THE MISTAKE HAD BEEN MADE TO BULK IN, I MET BE THERE, I SAW EXACTLY WHAT IT HAPPENED. WE, I TOLD BETH, DON'T WORRY ABOUT IT. WE'LL PULL IT BACK TO THE 12 FOOT. WE PULLED IT BACK TO THE 12 FOOT. BETH SAID, I I DON'T THINK THAT'S, THAT BOARD'S GONNA ACCEPT IT. YOU GOT 38 FOOT ON THE DRAWER. AND I EXPLAINED IT TO BELL, THE TO FOOTAGE. I SAID, I'M STILL CLOSE UP THE PROPERTY. HE SAID, ABOUT 38. I SAID, BELL, IF IT GONNA MAKE YOU HAPPY RIGHT IN THE MEETING. I SAID, I'LL PULL IT BACK FOUR MORE FOOT AND GIVE YOU FOUR MORE FOOT LATER. SAID SHE PUT A FLAG DOWN, WE GET IT. HE COMES ON, CHANGES EVERYTHING, BUT THE MANAGER ARE THE SAME TOTAL. IT'S LESS NOW THAN FRONTAGE IS AND WHETHER PERMITTED AND ON PAGE $1,900. BUT YOU, I'LL EXPLAIN IN MITIGATION IN THE, IN THE REAL WORLD, IN A NORMAL SITUATION, WE WOULD SAY PLAN IT BACK, RESTORE IT. THERE'S NO WAY TO PLANT BACK AN AREA THAT'S GOING ERODE AWAY. YOU'RE NOT GONNA HAVE A THREE YEAR MITIGATION PLAN BECAUSE NO PLANT IS GONNA LIVE THERE THREE YEARS. WOULD YOU AGREE WITH THAT? YEAH, THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S THE REASON FOR THAT. YOU CAN BLAME ME ON THAT ONE. BUT THE PLANT IS THE REASON I SAID DON'T FORGET THE RESTORATION BECAUSE THOSE PLANTS THAT YOU PLANNED THERE WERE NOWHERE IN THE WORLD GONNA LIVE THREE YEARS. DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT? THAT'S THE REASON FOR THE MITIGATION. I I, AND THAT'S WHY WE PULLED BACK BEHIND THE WETLAND WHERE WE HAD CABLE MITIGATION FEES. AS SOON AS WE DID IT, WE LOST IT. THAT'S A ROUGH SPOT THERE. UH, IT SURE IS. AND UH, THAT IS MY POINT. IT'S GONNA BE NOW THE BAR LAND USED TO GO FROM, FROM WHERE WE'RE AT RIGHT HERE, THERE ALL THE WAY PAST ALL THE CAP BOX PROPERTY. IT USED TO BE DOWN 150 FEET. I'D GUTTED UP POLE BUILDING, GOT BOB TO KNOW IT, AND IT LAST 30 YEARS, IT'S GONE. WE HAVE SOME OF THE SAME ISSUES ON BAYSIDE. NOT AS BADLY AS THAT, BUT I'VE SEEN A LOT OF PROPERTY THAT IN NORTHEAST WIND IS A ROUGH PARTNER. YES, SIR. ALRIGHT. RIGHT. UM, SIR, ANYTHING ELSE, MR. WATSON, UH, THAT YOU CAN POSSIBLY ENLIGHTEN US? UH, WE UNDERSTAND EVERYTHING ABOUT THE DISCREPANCY ON MEASUREMENT. UH, WE UNDERSTAND THAT YOU PULLED [01:15:01] IT BACK, THAT YOU PAID THE X NUMBER OF DOLLARS. UM, WHAT'S IT GOING TO TAKE FOR US TO COME TOGETHER RIGHT NOW TODAY AND PUT THIS TO BED? UM, I WOULD JUST SAY FROM, YOU KNOW, PERSPECTIVE OF WHAT'S BEEN APPROVED TO WHAT'S BEEN BUILT. UM, OBVIOUSLY WHEN THERE'S A DISCREPANCY LIKE THIS, WE BRING IT BACK BEFORE THE BOARD. YES, SIR. UM, SO, UH, JUST SAY FUNDAMENTALLY THE BOARD EITHER HAS TO, UH, MAKE IT MATCH WHAT WAS APPROVED OR, UH, PROVE THE WAY IT IS. APPROVE THE WAY IT IS. YES. I, I WOULD SAY I, EXCUSE ME. AND, UM, IF THE BOARD'S GONNA TAKE THE LATTER ACTION, UM, I, UM, MY BASIC UNDERSTANDING IS THAT VM C'S PO POLICY, OR MAYBE NOT POLICY, THAT'S THE LONG WORD, BUT, UM, IT'S CERTAINLY POSSIBLE AND MAYBE PROBABLE THAT VMRC WOULD TAKE JURISDICTION IF, AND THE PERMIT IS AMENDED A POST VIOLATION. I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY QUESTION OF THAT. UM, BUT IT MAY DO THAT ANYWAY BECAUSE OF THE SUB AQUEOUS, UH, ISSUE. I, I THINK THAT, UH, YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT AND NO MATTER WHAT WE DO, BMRC IS GOING TO, UH, BE THE ONE TO MAKE THE DECISION. SO I THINK RIGHT NOW, UH, GENTLEMEN, IT'S UP TO US TO, UH, DECIDE WHICH WAY WE WANT TO GO. AND THEN WHEN BMRC LOOKS AT, THEY CAN, UH, IT'S OUT OF OUR HANDS. SO WHAT I'M HEARING IT LOOKS AT, AND CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, IT LOOKS LIKE WE'RE OFF BY A FOOT AND FIVE INCHES IN REGARDS TO WHAT WE APPROVED ORIGINALLY. YEAH, WE APPROVED DONNIE, IT'S 88 7. IT'S AT, THAT'S A BUCK FIVE INCHES. SO I MEAN IT IT'S LESS THAN WHAT WE APPROVED. YEAH. WE'RE NOT OVER THAN WHAT IT, AND, BUT I REALLY FEEL STRONGLY THAT THE REVISED DRAWINGS SHOULD INCORPORATE THE DRAWINGS, THE MEASUREMENTS THAT MR. WATSON USED, BECAUSE IT'S VERY CLEAR THAT WE'VE HAD SO MANY, MANY WRONG MEASUREMENTS. OKAY. BUT I, I'M NOT GOING TO HAVE ANYTHING, MY VIEW THAT I THINK A FOOT AND FIVE INCHES, UH, I DON'T KNOW HOW, HOW THAT WOULD BE LOOKED AT. HE USED PAUL WATSON'S MEASUREMENTS. I'M STILL FOUR FOOT BACK, SUPPOSED TO BE. WE, WE HEARD YOU LOUD AND CLEAR. AND, AND I THINK HE KNOWS THAT, UM, MR. WATSON HAS INDICATED THAT THE NEW DRAWINGS ARE IN THE FILE WITH THE SAME JPA, UM, EXCEPT MY MEASUREMENTS ARE NOT THE RED MEASUREMENTS. OKAY. UM, AND IF THEY ARE PUT ON THE ORIGINAL DRAWINGS AND AFTER YOUR, UH, PAYMENT, UM, CAN WE DETERMINE, UM, IF THERE'S ANY OTHER FEES DUE IF YOU TAKE YOUR DRAWINGS? NOT TO MY KNOWLEDGE, NO, SIR. UM, THE, THE, THE MITIGATION FEE OF COURSE HAS ALREADY BEEN PAID. AND, UM, OKAY. SO YOU PUT YOUR DRAWINGS IN THAT FILE, UH, YOU ARE AT LEAST AS HAPPY AS YOU'RE GONNA GET BECAUSE YOU CAN APPEAL IT. THEY'RE GOING, UH, REVIEW IT AND IT'S OUT OF OUR HANDS TOO. DOES EVERYONE UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M TRYING TO GET TO HERE? SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING THAT SMALL DIFFERENCE IN REGARDS TO, WOULD THAT MAKE ANY MORE, NEED, ANY MORE MITIGATION FEE AND THE IDEA WHO JUST SAID NO, THAT'S WHAT YOU DON'T NEED ANYMORE. THAT'S RIGHT. WE ALL YOU UNDERSTAND, UH, HANK NO, I'M, I'M, I'M SO, SO THE MONEY IS THE MONEY. PUT THE NEW DRAWINGS IN THERE. YOU CAN APPEAL IT TO, UH, DONALD TRUMP. UM, SOONER OR LATER IT WILL GET IN THEIR HANDS AND THAT'S OUT OF OURS. SO, UH, I WOULD LIKE, UH, TO, I WOULD LIKE TO CALL ON ONE SECOND PLEASE. WE GOT WAY AHEAD OF OURSELVES. RIGHT? UM, IS THERE ANYONE ELSE HERE THAT WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ONLY ABOUT THIS? JPA? NOT, I'M GONNA CLOSE THE FLOOR. I'M GONNA OPEN IT TO THE PUBLIC. ANYBODY GOT ANYTHING TO SAY? CLOSE THE FLOOR. WE HAVE ALREADY TAKEN PRECEDENT. JUST ONE QUICK SORT OF A BOOKKEEPING QUESTION FOR MS. GORMAN IS, HOW IS THIS GOING TO BE LABELED IN THE FILE? IS THIS GONNA BE LIKE A REVISED OR IS THERE A SPECIAL WORD, LIKE AMENDED? HOW IS THIS GOING TO APPEAR TO PEOPLE IN OUR FILE? IT IS CURRENTLY SUBMITTED AS A REVISION. OKAY. BUT SINCE THERE WAS A PERMIT ACTION, IT'S JUST SITTING IN THE FILE. THE PERMIT HAS NOT BEEN REVISED, SO, OKAY. SO IT'S GONNA BE A REVISION AT THE END. BASICALLY ONCE IT, HOPEFULLY ONCE IT'S DONE, WE DO NOT REVISE PERMITS. YEAH. AFTER, AFTER WE FIVE MINUTES FROM [01:20:01] NOW, IT'S GOING TO BE, UH, DIRECTED AT HER AND YOU CAN PUT IT IN A FILE IN THE FASHION THAT IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE IN. IT'S ALREADY, IT'S ALREADY IN THE FILE. UM, IF YOU ALL CHOOSE TO REVISE YOUR PERMIT, THAT IS SEPARATE FROM OUR PERMIT. 'CAUSE WE DO NOT MODIFY PERMITS. RIGHT. OKAY. SO THIS IS WHERE I'M GETTING AT. SO YOU'RE GOING DO ANOTHER PERMIT NUMBER OR I CAN'T SPEAK TO WHAT WE WILL DO BECAUSE IT DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU ALL DECIDE TO DO. I THINK, UH, YOU ARE. OKAY, THANK YOU. INCORRECT WITH THE NEW, I THINK WE'VE DETERMINED THERE'LL BE NO NEW PERMIT NUMBER. WE'RE GOING TO, UH, I THINK THE, UH, MOTION NEEDS TO BE PUTTING, UM, THE NEW NUMBERS THAT'S IN THE FILE AND, UM, THE LITTLE BIT OF DIFFERENCE, UH, YOU ARE WILLING TO SUCK UP. YOU ALREADY PAID 18. WE'RE DONE. YEAH. CAN I SEE THE ORIGINAL ONE MORE TIME? THERE'S THAT ONE MEASUREMENT, 15. THAT MEASUREMENT FROM THE, UH, FURTHER SOUTH, THE HUNDRED FOOT. THERE'S JUNIOR. IS THERE A MEASUREMENT FROM THAT HUNDRED FROM THE SOUTH END TO, TO THE, UH, BULKHEAD THAT IN THAT AREA WITHIN THERE WHERE YOU HAD TO, YOU KNOW, IS THERE A, IS THERE A MEASUREMENT THERE? IT'S 38 BUT FROM THE SOUTH, SOUTH IN THAT AREA, LITTLE AREA THERE, THAT RIGHT HERE, THAT WAS TWO FOOT LEFT. NO, THAT'S TWO FOOT. THAT AREA RIGHT THERE. IS THERE A MEASUREMENT? 12 FOOT THROUGH THE PROPERTY LINE BACK? IT WAS, IT WAS, IT WAS THERE MEASUREMENT THERE WRITTEN THERE SOMEWHERE? NO. WELL, YOU GOT 15. I, I GET IT. THE ANGLE, I PICK THE ANGLE, IT WOULD BE 12 FOOT. I GET WHERE YOUR ANGLE AND WHERE THAT IT'D BE 12 FOOT AND THAT'S 16 FOOT. THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S MY THING THAT I JUST WANNA TO SEE THAT YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M SAYING? PERFECTLY UNDERSTAND. SO I, I GET, LIKE I SAID, I KNOW THE 12 FOOT ISN'T WRITTEN ON THE OLD ONE, BUT I DO SEE THE 15 FOOT USING IT. EVEN IF YOU USED THE 15 FOOT. OKAY. UM, YEAH, I GET, I GET, I GET IT. THAT'S WHY I WANNA SEE. I DIDN'T SEE. SO WE HAVE BEEN, WE'VE CLOSED, WE'VE OPENED EVERYBODY'S SAID YEAH. THEIR PIECE. AND NOW, UM, THE MOTION NEEDS TO INCLUDE, UH, WHAT HE'S PAID FOR AND THE MEASUREMENTS. YEAH. AS IS I'LL. AND, UH, I CALL FOR A MOTION PLEASE, MR. CHAIRMAN. I MAKE A MOTION TO ACCEPT REVISED DRAWINGS BEING THAT WE APPROVED 90 FOOT A BALL KIT AND ON THE ORIGINAL THERE WAS DEFINITELY TWO WRONG MEASUREMENTS PRESENTED, PRESENTED BY MR. BRIT BARICK. AND IT'S NOT OUR STAFF'S FAULT. IT'S TWO WRONG MEASUREMENTS AND UH, BUT IT STILL TOTALS 90 FOOT. THE STAFF'S MEASUREMENTS NOW IS 88.7. AND, UM, THE COMPENSATION'S ALREADY BEEN MADE. AND I DO NOT THAT V VM R C'S GONNA BE REVIEWING THIS, BUT ON OUR POINT, LIKE YOU SAID, THERE WERE DEFINITELY TWO WRONG MEASUREMENTS, BUT THE TOTAL ENDED UP THE SAME. AND, UH, THAT'S, THAT'S MY MOTION. AND YOUR MOTION IS TO ACCEPT IT. TO ACCEPT, TO ACCEPT THE, BE BROUGHT DRAWN AS. ALRIGHT, THAT'S GOOD. UH, ANYBODY WANTS TO SECOND THAT? I, I'LL SECOND IT, BUT I GOT A COMMENT. SEE? UM, WOULD THAT INCLUDE, THE RED MEASUREMENTS ARE, 'CAUSE WHAT'S ON FILE AT VMRC DOES NOT HAVE STAFF'S MEASUREMENTS. IT'S STRICTLY 88 7 IS CORRECT. I I DO WANT THEM ON THERE. GETTING READY TO BE ON THERE. YEAH. OKAY. SO YOU'RE GONNA PUT YOUR MEASUREMENTS ON THERE. OKAY. SO MEASURE, SHOULD I GET SURVEYOR TO COME DOWN AND GIVE YOU THE MEASURES? WAIT JUST A MINUTE. ALRIGHT. SO, UM, HE'S GONNA PUT HIS DIMENSION ON THERE. UH, JUNIOR IS WILLING TO ACCEPT IT AS IT IS UNTIL IT GOES TO VRC. SO WHY, WHY BRINGING THAT UP ABOUT A SURVEY. NOW WE'RE GETTING READY TO APPROVE WHAT WE GOT. YOU DO WHAT YOU WANT. WE REMEMBER THAT YOU'RE GONNA FEEL IT AND IT'S GOING TO THEM. I'M NOT GONNA APPEAL THIS DECISION TODAY. ALRIGHT SIR, YOU'RE GONNA MAKE THE MOTION. YOU'RE GONNA MAKE A SECOND? YES. SECOND, UH, MR. BADGER, I CALL FOR A VOTE PLEASE TO ACCEPT IT AS PRESENTED. A AYE AYE IT IS IN THE BOOK. THANK YOU EVERYBODY. UM, IF YOU'LL ALLOW ME, SIR, UM, 'CAUSE I DO THIS FOR NOTHING . UM, CAN, CAN YOU HELP US, UH, THE NEXT TIME, UH, MAKE SURE THE DRAWINGS ARE, UH, LARGER OR BETTER OR EASIER TO READ? UH, GET SOMEBODY, YOU HAVE A YOUNG LADY IN OFFICE? YES, SIR. OKAY. SO PLEASE, YOU ALREADY ARE AS MA'AM. YEAH. UH, SO IF YOU WOULD DO THAT, IT WOULD MAKE ALL OF OUR LIVES EASIER. THANK YOU. UH, IT'S IN THE BOOK. THANK YOU. ALRIGHT. UH, THAT'S IT FOR OLD BUSINESS, UH, NUMBER SIX. UNDER OTHER BUSINESSES, POLICIES AND PROCEDURES. MR. WATSON, IS THERE ANYTHING YOU WISH TO CHANGE [01:25:01] OR MAKE US AWARE OF UNDER POLICIES AND PROCEDURES? UM, AT THE LAST MEETING WE HAD A DISCUSSION ABOUT, UH, GETTING DEVICES FOR STAFF TO GO OUT AND PINPOINT, UM, YES SPOTS. THAT'S GREAT. AND WE HAVE DISCUSSED THAT IT IS, UH, PROBLEMATIC, UM, AS FAR AS, UH, I GUESS STAFF RESOURCES AND, UM, AND ALSO, UH, HAVING, I GUESS THE CONTRACTORS RELYING ON US AS OPPOSED TO THEM, UH, TAKING RESPONSIBILITY ABOUT WHERE THINGS ARE LOCATED. YES, SIR. UM, SO, UH, WE COULD CERTAINLY LOOK INTO THAT FURTHER WITH ANY SUGGESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE, BUT IT, IT, IT DOES SEEM TO BE, IT'S, IT'S SIMILAR TO, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, FOUNDATIONS, UH, ON A SITE PLAN. IF YOU HAVE A REALLY TIGHT LOT, UM, WE REQUIRE, UM, IN SOME CIRCUMSTANCES FOR A SURVEYOR TO GO OUT AND, AND, AND, AND STAKE EXACTLY WHERE, UH, THAT FOUNDATION IS GONNA BE. AND THEN THE SURVEYOR HAS TO PROVIDE US WITH A LETTER SAYING THAT THAT'S ACCURATE BECAUSE, UH, IT'S AGAIN, PROBLEMATIC FOR COUNTY STAFF TO BE, UH, UH, NUMBER ONE, HAVE THE RESOURCES TO DO IT, BUT THEN NUMBER TWO, BECOME RESPONSIBLE, UH, FOR THAT LOCATION ONCE WE DO THAT. UM, SO I WOULD BE HAPPY TO DISCUSS IT, UH, WITH THE BOARD OR INDIVIDUAL BOARD MEMBERS FURTHER ABOUT HOW WE COULD ACCOMPLISH THIS. OR MAYBE THERE'S ANOTHER, UH, WE METHOD OF US DETERMINING THIS. WE TALKED ABOUT THIS LAST TIME AND BEEN KICKING IT AROUND. UM, I'M NOT QUITE SURE WHAT WE CAN DO. UH, WHAT CAN, CAN WE FORCE EVERY, UH, CONTRACTOR TO HAVE A SURVEYOR PINPOINT IT? UH, SOME OF THE CITIES REQUIRE IT, LIKE VIRGINIA BEACH, I BELIEVE REQUIRES IT. BUT THAT'S ASKING A LOT FOR SOME OF THESE. I FIND IT, UH, TOUGH PILL, UH, FOR OUR LITTLE GROUP. AND WHAT HAPPENS, UH, WE'VE HAD A TREMENDOUS DAY TODAY, BUT MOST OF IT WAS , UM, ASIG. BUT, UM, I, I FIND IT EXTREMELY HARD PILL TO SWALLOW THAT WE'RE GOING TO CHANGE OUR GAME PLAN RIGHT NOW, BUT, UH, WE DON'T HAVE TO APPROVE IT OR NOT APPROVE IT TODAY. THERE'S NO VOTE. JUST, UH, KICK IT AROUND AND GET EVERYBODY'S OPINION. THE ADVICE I WAS TALKING ABOUT IS THE $800 ADVICE, BUT IT STILL ONLY GETS YOU IN THREE FOOT, BUT IT'S STILL BETTER. ANOTHER DON'T PEN PEN POINT, BUT LIKE I SAID, BUT IT IS NARROWS IT DOWN. LIKE I SAID, IT'S ALSO THUMB MAP. THEY TELL YOU IF YOU WANT YOUR OWN, YOUR PROPERTY OR SOMEBODY ELSE'S PROPERTY, THAT'S A $10 A MONTH APP THAT AS YOU'RE WALKING, MAKE SURE YOU'RE NOT WALKING ON SOMEBODY ELSE'S PROPERTY. UM, THERE'S, THERE'S THINGS WELL, AND, AND, AND THE DRAWINGS REQUIRE YOU TO HAVE BENCHMARKS. YES. AND SO OFTEN THEY'RE NOT THERE. CORRECT. SO IN THEORY, IT SHOULDN'T EVEN BE COMING TO US IF IT'S NOT A COMPLETED APPLICATION. BENCHMARK SHOULD BE ON EVERY PERMIT. EVERY JPA SHOULD INCLUDE BENCHMARKS AND WE DON'T GET NO. AND THAT WE GET INTO THESE, UH, THINGS, UH, HIGH WATER, LOW WATER MM-HMM . UM, DOES IT FALL ON THE, ON THE BULKHEAD OR NOT? AND WE FIGHT IT EVERY MONTH. MM-HMM . SO ANYTHING THAT CAN, UH, REDUCE THAT PERCENTAGE OF ISSUE WITH THOSE FEW THINGS THAT ARE ELEMENTARY TO ME, UH, I THINK THAT'S WHAT WE NEED TO PURSUE, BE IT, UH, BE IT AN APP OR BE IT, UH, WORST CASE FOR THE UH, UH, CONSTRUCTION PEOPLE IS TO HAVE A SURVEY. SO I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING WE NEED TO KICK AROUND. I'M NOT SURE TODAY IS THE TIME TO DO IT. UH, IF YOU WOULD, UM, KICK IT AROUND, WE CAN HAVE POLICIES AND PROCEDURES NEXT MONTH, OR EXCUSE ME ON THE 22ND. UM, THANK YOU. UM, AND JUST TO BE CLEAR, UM, THE POLICIES AND PROCEDURES MANUAL HAS NOT BEEN ADOPTED BY THE BOARD YET. YES. AND I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT, UH, IF THE BOARD WANTED TO ENTERTAIN THAT TODAY. I DON'T HAVE ANY POSITION ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. FRANKLY. I THOUGHT IT, I I I THOUGHT IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN VOTED ON LAST TIME, BUT I LOST TRACK OF THINGS. I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE EVERYBODY'S CLEAR ON THAT. I'M SURE WE DIDN'T ADOPT THAT AFTER SEVERAL CHANGES WHEN THE OTHER LADY WAS HERE. OKAY. AND SHE KNOWS. SO WE, WE CHECKED THE MINUTES JUST TO BE CERTAIN AND UH, WE CAN WE APPROVE IT? DO IT NOW? OR YOU WANT TO PUT IT ON NEXT MONTH? I THINK WE CAN DO IT RIGHT NOW. WE KICKED IT AND KICKED IT AROUND. WE HAVE. ALRIGHT. UH, THE MOTION WILL BE TO ACCEPT THE MANUAL ON [01:30:01] POLICIES AND PROCEDURES. IS THAT CORRECT? YES, SIR. ALRIGHT. UM, I'D LIKE TO ASK FOR DISCUSSION AND A MOTION TO ACCEPT. WELL, I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY. THE PROCEDURES WERE THE IN COUNTY ISSUES, THERE WAS A POLICY IN REGARDS TO WETLANDS MITIGATION, WE'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT THE PROCEDURE ENCOUNTER PROCEDURES. CORRECT? THAT'S WHAT WE'RE VOTING ON. YES. JUST FOR ONE SECOND, PLEASE. MR. PAN, WOULD YOU PLEASE APPROACH, UH, IS, IS YOUR COMMENT RELATING TO THIS? IT CAN BE RELATED TO BOTH OF THE TOPICS THAT YOU WERE DISCUSSING ON . SURE. SO, SO GETTING BACK TO THE, UM, THE MEASURING DEVICE AS THE DEPUTY COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR OVER THIS PARTICULAR, UH, FUNCTION, MEANING ENVIRONMENTAL PROGRAMS AND SUPPORTING THE WETLANDS BOARD, THE MONEY FOR THE DEVICE IS NOT THE ISSUE. IT'S THE OWNERSHIP OF THE, OF THE RESULT AFTERWARDS. AND ESPECIALLY IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, UH, A DEVICE THAT ISN'T ACCURATE ENOUGH, AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A THREE FOOT IN EITHER DIRECTION, UH, OR ANY DIRECTION, A A A THREE FOOT VARIANCE, IF YOU WILL. I'M NOT SURE THAT, UH, I COULD SIGN OFF ON OWNING SUCH INACCURACY. I'M NOT SURE WHAT GUN IT'LL DO AS FRANKLY, SIR. RIGHT. SO, UH, SO MY POSITION ON THAT IS THAT WE WOULD NOT, UH, WE WOULD NOT ACQUIRE A DEVICE AND WE WOULD NOT DEPLOY SUCH A DEVICE THAT HAS THAT LEVEL OF INACCURACY ASSOCIATED WITH IT, ESPECIALLY IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A MATTER OF FEET. AND THAT COULD MAKE A BIG DIFFERENCE. WITH REGARDS TO YOUR, UM, WITH REGARDS TO YOUR POLICIES AND PROCEDURES MANUAL, THAT'S BASICALLY YOUR BYLAWS. AND, UH, WHATEVER MOTION YOU ADOPT TODAY, I WOULD JUST SUGGEST THAT YOU INDICATED IN THERE THE MOST RECENT VERSION OF THE POLICIES AND PROCEDURES MANUAL. AND THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD PRETTY MUCH COVER YOU IN MY OPINION. AND THAT THOSE CONCLUDE MY REMARKS AND I CAN FEEL ANY QUESTIONS AT THIS TIME. ANY QUESTIONS FROM MR. PDU? THANK YOU. RIGHT. THANK YOU. I THINK WE UNDERSTAND EXACTLY WHAT YOU'RE TELLING US. UM, SO CONSIDERING THOSE COMMENTS, UH, ANY OTHER, LET'S, LET'S HAVE A MOTION. NO, NO, NO. UH, I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE, UH, POLICY AND PROCEDURES THAT HAVE BEEN, WE'VE BEEN ADDRESSING FOR THE LAST THREE OR FOUR MONTHS, MOST RECENT, UH, AND THE MOST WITH THE MOST RECENT, UH, UH, DRAFT. RIGHT. THANK YOU MR. BADGER. UH, SECOND. I'LL SECOND THAT MOTION. THANK YOU MR. ICK. MAY WE HAVE A VOTE, PLEASE? AYE, AYE, UH, THAT IS ON THE BOOK AND IT'S, IT'S ACCEPTING THE LATEST ADDITION OF POLICIES AND PROCEDURES. YOU'VE BEEN KICKING THE ROUND AND WE ARE LEAVING OUT THE DEVICE THAT IS INACCURATE. UH, I DON'T SEE WHERE THAT WILL DO US ANY GOOD. YEAH. UM, GO AHEAD. ANY COMMENT? I HAVE A, JUST A FEW OTHER THINGS TO REPORT TO THE BOARD CARRY ON. UM, FOR THE WALLOPS ISLAND CAUSEWAY OF THE CHECK THAT WAS RECEIVED FOR MITIGATION WAS 1000, I'M SORRY, $128,358. UM, AND THE ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEERS TOOK, UH, 0.167 ACRES OR 7,274 SQUARE FEET FOR THEIR MITIGATION, UH, WHICH WAS DONE BY CREDIT, I BELIEVE. UM, THE SECOND THING IS, UH, I ATTENDED A PRE-APPLICATION MEETING FOR THE WILD ISLAND SHORELINE PROJECT, AND I, UH, ASKED THE QUESTION AS TO WHETHER ANY WETLANDS WERE INVOLVED AS OPPOSED TO BEACH OR DUNES. AND IT APPEARS AS IF THAT WILL BE AN ENTIRELY, UH, BEACH DUNE ISSUE, NOT A WETLANDS ISSUE. AND FINALLY, UM, FOR THE NEXT MEETING, WE HAVE, UH, FIVE ENFORCEMENT ACTIONS. UH, FOUR OF THOSE HAVE PERMITS ASSOCIATED WITH THEM A AFTER THE FACT PERMITS. AND THAT'S ALL WE HAVE FOR THAT MEETING. THANK YOU, SIR. UM, SO IF WE ARE ANY, ANY LAST QUESTIONS FROM MR. WATSON? I JUST HAVE ONE COMMENT. BASICALLY, I WANT THANK THE PROFESSIONALISM AND PATIENTS OF OUR COUNTY STAFF AND HANDLING THIS COMPLAINTS. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR DOING, SIR. THANK YOU. WE APPRECIATE EVERYBODY. AND, UM, UH, WE HAVE, UH, A REGULARLY SCHEDULED MEETING OF MAY 22ND. IT'S FOURTH THURSDAY. UH, SO OBVIOUSLY TWO THIS MONTH, BUT, UM, PART OF LIFE. UM, SO I'D LIKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN. SECOND, MR. CHAND. SECOND. SECOND. THANK YOU. VOTE WE ARE ADJOURNED. YAY. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.