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10 O'CLOCK.[Wetlands Board on July 17, 2025.]
TO ORDER.WELCOME TO THE JULY MEETING OF THE ACK COUNTY WETLANDS BOARD.
WHILE GOING THROUGH INTRODUCTORY REMARKS, PLEASE TAKE TIME TO SILENCE OR CUT OFF YOUR CELL PHONE.
WETLANDS BOARD CONSISTS OF FIVE MEMBERS.
APPROVAL OF PERMITS REQUIRES MAJORITY VOTE ARE THREE YAY VOTES.
TODAY WE HAVE FOUR MEMBERS PRESENT.
WE HAVE A QUORUM, MR. UH, ICK.
COULD NOT MAKE IT, BUT WE HAVE VICE CHAIR, MR. WARD.
MR. TAYLOR, MR. BADGER, I'M T LEE.
BY IF I MAY INTRODUCE OUR STAFF AND OFFICIALS PRESENT, WE HAVE MS. JULIE FLOYD, ENVIRONMENTAL SPECIALIST.
UH, WE HAVE MS. GINGER HARMON, ADMINISTRATIVE ASSISTANT.
MR. PAUL WATSON, DEPUTY DIRECTOR CODE ADMINISTRATION DIVISION.
HE'S, UH, DEPUTY COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR.
I KNOW YOU HAD A ROUGH MORNING.
UH, THE BOARD IS AWARE AND COMPLIES AS CLOSELY AS POSSIBLE TO THE OBJECTIVES OF THE VIRGINIA MARINE RESOURCES COMMISSION WETLANDS, UH, POLICY OF NO NET LOSS.
ALL APPROVED PERMITS ARE GRANTED FOR A TWO YEAR PERIOD FROM THE DATE OF THIS HEARING, UNLESS SPECIFICALLY NOTED ALL PERSONS SPEAKING BEFORE THE BOARD WILL BE SWORN IN.
UH, OBVIOUSLY WE HAD NO MEETING LAST MONTH, SO WE'RE, UM, LOOKING AT MAY.
I HOPE THAT EVERYONE HAS HAD TIME TO LOOK AT, UH, THE AGENDA OF TODAY'S MEETING.
ANYBODY HAVE QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? ALRIGHT.
UH, I'D LIKE A MOTION AND A VOTE TO MOTION PRESENT.
AYE, THEY'RE IN THE BOOK, UH, MINUTES.
EVERYONE HAS HAD TIME TO LOOK THAT OVER.
ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? THANK YOU.
I, I'M NOT SURE IF WE HAVE THE MAY MINUTES PREPARED.
BUT BASICALLY, MAY I REPHRASE? ANYONE HAVE AN ISSUE WITH ANYTHING THAT HAPPENED DURING THE MAY MEETING? IF YOU CAN, I CAN'T REMEMBER WHAT I HAD FOR BREAKFAST, BUT
IF THERE'S ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS AFTER YOU GET THE MEETING MINUTES, UH, PUT TOGETHER, CERTAINLY REPORT AND WE WILL GO FROM THERE NEXT MONTH IF IT'S OKAY WITH EVERYBODY.
SO IF WE'RE THROUGH EVERYTHING, AND AS YOU ALL KNOW, THERE WAS AN HVAC ISSUE, I THINK, AND THAT'S WHY WE DIDN'T HAVE A MEETING LAST MONTH.
UH, SO WE'RE GOOD TO GO AND EVERYBODY'S NICE AND COOL.
WE'RE GONNA GO BACK TO OLD BUSINESS FIRST, WHICH IS UNUSUAL FOR THIS BOARD.
BUT, UH, WE'RE GONNA GO BACK TO ITEM FOUR.
IT IS THE, UH, MICHAEL PULASKI VIOLATION, SIR? YES, SIR.
SIR, CAN YOU GIVE US A SYNOPSIS? SURE.
UM, PAUL WATSON, UH, DEPUTY DIRECTOR CODE ADMINISTRATION.
DO YOU AFFIRM OR SWEAR YOU'LL TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH IN ALL MATTERS BEFORE THIS BOARD? I DO.
SO, THIS, UH, ORIG OR THIS PROJECT, UH, IS AT THE END OF STARBOARD STREET.
IT'S, UH, IN UNDEVELOPED LOT, MR. PULASKI LIVES AS YOU'RE LOOKING OUT AT SCOT BAY TO THE RIGHT OF THIS UNDEVELOPED LOT, OR AT LEAST HAS A HOUSE THERE.
AND IT IS, UH, BASICALLY RIP WRAP THAT WAS PLACED, UH, ABOUT 40 FEET OFFSHORE TO PROTECT THE VEGETATIVE WETLANDS.
UM, AND ORIGINALLY, UH, THIS STEMMED FROM A VISIT TO THE SITE WHILE, UH, THIS OFFSHORE REVETMENT WAS BEING CONSTRUCTED, UM, THE AFFECTED WETLANDS AREAS OF, UH, 204 SQUARE FEET.
SO THESE ARE THE DOCUMENTS FROM THE ORIGINAL SUBMITTAL.
UH, YOU CAN SEE MR. POLOWSKI'S HOUSE THERE AND THE AFFECTED MARSH WOULD BE, UH, THE MARSH IMMEDIATELY IN FRONT OF THAT HOUSE.
UM, THE MARSH DID CHANGE SOMEWHAT BETWEEN THESE PICTURES BACK IN, UH, 2024.
AND, AND WHEN THIS, UH, CONSTRUCTION STARTED, AND HERE'S THE
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SCHEMATIC OF WHAT WAS DONE.OBVIOUSLY THE RED LINE IS THE BREAKWATER.
UH, THE GREEN DOTTED LINE WAS THE EDGE OF THE MARSH AND THE LOW PROFILE BERM IS, UH, THE EDGE OF THE PARKING LOT.
AND HERE ARE PICTURES THAT WERE TAKEN, UH, WHEN THE ORIGINAL JPA WELL WAS FILED.
THIS IS OBVIOUSLY LOOKING OUT TOWARDS CHESAPEAKE OR SHIITE BAY, AND THIS IS TO THE LEFT OF THAT LOT.
AND THIS IS LOOKING FROM MR. POLOWSKI'S HOUSE ACROSS THE ENTIRE UNDEVELOPED LOT.
YOU CAN SEE THE END OF STARBOARD STREET TO THE LEFT THERE WHERE THE JET SKI IS PARKED.
AND HERE'S ANOTHER PICTURE FROM THAT SAME DATE OF THE MARSH, I BELIEVE THIS IS THE LAST PICTURE OF THE MARSH FROM THAT DAY.
AND THEN THIS IS WHEN THE, UH, OFFSHORE REVETMENT WAS BEING, OR BREAK ORDER WAS BEING CONSTRUCTED.
AND SHOWS THE PLACEMENT OF, UH, THE RIP WRAP ON THAT EXACT SAME MARSH THAT YOU JUST SAW IN THE PREVIOUS PICTURES.
AND JUST SOME ADDITIONAL PICTURES SHOWING THE STORAGE OF THE ROCKS ON THE MARSH.
AND NOW THESE ARE PICTURES, UM, OBVIOUSLY FROM JUNE 12TH, 2025, SHOWING THAT, UH, AS YOU CAN SEE, THE BOTTOM LEFT HAND CORNER WOULD BE THE TOP LEFT HAND CORNER THAT THE MARSH IS, UH, GROWING BACK, UM, AND IS LOOKING A LOT BETTER.
UM, HERE IS EXACTLY WHERE MOST OF THE ROCKS WERE PLACED.
THERE WAS STILL A PRETTY HEAVY LEVEL LAYER OF GRAVEL EMBEDDED IN THE MUD.
AND OBVIOUSLY IN THIS PARTICULAR SPOT, THE MARSH HAS HAD NOT GROWN BACK AT ALL.
AND HERE'S JUST SOME OTHER EXAMPLES OF, AS YOU'RE LOOKING OF LEFT TO RIGHT THEN, RIGHT TO LEFT ACROSS THIS AREA OF THE EXTENT THAT IT, THAT IT HAS GROWN BACK.
AND I'LL JUST GO BACK THROUGH THESE SO YOU CAN SEE EXACTLY.
THIS IS OBVIOUSLY TO THE RIGHT OF THE LOT, MR. POLOWSKI'S HOUSE BEING IN THE UPPER RIGHT HAND CORNER.
THIS IS TO THE LEFT OF THE LOT.
AND THIS WOULD BE THE CENTER OF THE LOT.
UM, MADE ANOTHER SITE VISIT YESTERDAY, THE TIDE WAS MUCH HIGHER AND YOU STILL COULD SEE, UH, THE CONDITION OF THE MARSH, UM, BECAUSE THE TIDE WAS HIGHER.
UH, PICTURES WERE NOT, UH, WERE NOT GONNA SHOW ANYTHING, BUT IT ESSENTIALLY LOOKED THE SAME.
UM, MR. PULASKI REPORTED THAT HE AND HIS WIFE HAD REMOVED A LOT OF THE GRAVEL OUT OF THE MUD, AND THAT DID APPEAR LIKE THAT HAD HAPPENED FROM THE, THE WATER'S VERY CLEAR, YOU COULD SEE DOWN TO THE MUD.
IT DID NOT APPEAR TO HAVE NEARLY AS MUCH GRAVEL OR MUCH GRAVEL AT ALL LEFT THERE.
UM, AND I HAD ASKED MR. PULASKI SEVERAL TIMES FOR PICTURES OF THE SITE IMMEDIATELY BEFORE CONSTRUCTION.
HE BROUGHT ME A THUMB DRIVE TODAY.
I'M GONNA TRY TO LOAD THAT UP TO SHOW YOU ALL, BECAUSE IN FAIRNESS, I TOLD HIM THAT I THINK THE BOARD WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE CONDITION IMMEDIATELY BEFORE CONSTRUCTION AS OPPOSED TO PICTURES A YEAR OR TWO BEFORE.
UM, AND PAUL, I WOULD REQUEST THAT I PRESENT THOSE PICTURES AND THAT'S FINE.
UM, SO BEYOND THAT, I WOULD JUST OFFER TO THE BOARD THESE, THIS TO THE BEST OF OUR ABILITY TO SHOW THE BOARD WHAT THE CONDITION WAS BEFORE AND WHAT THE CONDITION WAS AFTER IS, UH, DEMONSTRATED BY THE PICTURES THAT WE HAVE, UH, BOTH, UH, PRE-CONSTRUCTION BEING A YEAR OR SO BEFOREHAND.
AND THEN POST-CONSTRUCTION AND SHOWING THE LOSS OF WETLANDS RESULTING FROM THE PLACEMENT OF THE ROCK DIRECTLY ON THE WETLANDS.
YOU HAVE THE THUMB DRIVE IF YOU'RE GONNA LOAD UP.
I HAVE MR. POLOWSKI'S THUMB DRIVE AND I CAN LOAD THAT UP AND HE WISHES TO DO THAT.
JUST TELL ME WHEN YOU HAVE IT LOADED UP, MR. PULASKI.
WOULD YOU COME FORWARD AND LET ME, LET ME SWEAR YOU IN AND YOU'LL BE GOOD TO GO.
SIR, DO YOU AFFIRM OR SWEAR THAT YOU'LL TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH IN ALL MATTERS BEFORE THIS BOARD? I DO.
YOU TAKE US THROUGH IT AND WE'LL GO FROM THERE.
WELL, BEFORE PAUL GETS TO THE PICTURES, I DO HAVE SOMETHING I'D LIKE TO, UH, READ.
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I'VE BEEN BEFORE THIS BOARD A FEW TIMES.WOULD YOU REPEAT THAT, SIR? I'VE BEEN BEFORE THIS BOARD A FEW TIMES.
UM, ALL OF THOSE MEETINGS WERE PRETTY GOOD.
YOU KNOW, I WAS A HOMEOWNER THAT WAS TRYING TO SAVE THE WETLANDS AS WELL AS SAVE MY, MY, UH, PROPERTY.
SO, UM, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WORK THAT WAS DONE RELATED TO AN APPROVED VMRC PERMIT.
AND I AM HERE TODAY TO DISPUTE THE ASSERT THAT ANY SIGNIFICANT WETLANDS DAMAGE OCCURRED BY RESULT OF MY ACTIONS OR THE ACTIONS OF MY CONTRACTOR.
IN ADDITION, I'M SURE YOU'RE ALL AWARE THAT I HAD FILED IN MARCH FILED COMPLAINTS WITH THE ATTORNEY GENERAL AS WELL AS OTHER AGENCIES.
AND I'M CONCERNED WITH THE TIMING ON THIS, THAT THIS COULD BE SOMEWHAT RETALIATORY DUE TO THOSE COMPLAINTS, AND I'LL GET INTO THAT IN A LITTLE BIT.
SO I'M REALLY GLAD TO SEE THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE WETLANDS AT STARBOARD STREET.
I WISH WE HAD DONE A LITTLE BIT MORE ON THIS TWO YEARS AGO.
SO, UM, WITH THAT, IF WE COULD GO INTO THE PICTURES.
I DO HAVE HARD COPIES IF YOU LIKE YOUR OWN COPY.
DO YOU WANT PLEASE? I WOULD SOMETIMES EASIER THAN LOOKING AT THE SCREEN.
I'M SORRY, DO YOU HAVE A COPY? I HAVE AN EXTRA COPY.
AND IF I COULD, I'M SORRY TO INTERRUPT, BUT THAT'S ALL RIGHT.
I WOULD JUST, UH, LIKE TO SAY THAT I WAS NOT THINKING ABOUT THIS WHEN MR. MOLESKI HANDED ME THE THUMB DRIVE THIS MORNING, BUT WE'RE NOT ALLOWED TO PUT THUMB DRIVES IN COMPUTERS UNLESS BEEN CLEARED BY IT.
UM, BUT IF WE HAVE THE PAPER COPY, I THINK THAT WAS THE CASE.
I CAN SEND IT TO YOU IN EMAIL.
WHY, WHY DON'T YOU JUST WALK US THROUGH THIS? OKAY.
SO IF WE GO OVER PICTURE ONE, THIS IS TWO.
I'M USING THE AKIMA COUNTY GIS, THIS IS 2002.
NOW, IF YOU LOOK AT THAT, YOU'LL SEE WHAT IS APPROXIMATELY A 250 FOOT SOLID SEAWALL, NO BRAKES.
THAT GIAN SEAWALL WAS REQUIRED BY THE ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEERS IN 1974 WHEN THEY APPROVED CAPTAIN'S COVE.
I HAVE THE ORIGINAL ARMY CORPS DOCUMENTATION THAT CLEARLY SHOWS THAT THE IMPLEMENTATION OF THAT SEAWALL WAS REQUIRED BEFORE THEY COULD MOVE FORWARD WITH THE DEVELOPMENT OF CAPTAIN'S CODE.
SO AT THIS POINT, THIS IS ALREADY IN PLACE FOR, YOU KNOW, SINCE 1974.
NOW, WANT YOU TO LOOK AT THE PROPERTY TO THE RIGHT.
AT THAT POINT, THAT OWNER WAS IMPLEMENTING A LOW PROFILE BULKHEAD BEHIND THE GIAN SEA WALL.
YOU'LL NOTICE THAT THEY HAVE HEAVY EQUIPMENT OUT ON THE MARSH, AND THEY LAID NUMEROUS PIECES OF PLYWOOD DOWN ON THE MARSHLAND AS PADDING, I GUESS IS WHAT YOU'RE CALLING IT.
UM, SO THAT WAS SOMETHING THAT THEY WERE DOING BACK IN 2002.
SO LET'S MOVE TO PICTURE NUMBER TWO, 2009, SEVEN YEARS LATER, UM, AT THIS POINT THAT SEA WALL HAD BEEN IN PLACE FOR OVER 30 YEARS.
AND ONE THING THAT YOU'LL NOTICE IS THAT WHILE THERE'S REALLY NO CHANGE IN THOSE SEVEN YEARS, UM, THERE IS A LITTLE BIT THAT'S STARTING TO ERODE ON MY PROPERTY.
BUT THE PROPERTY NEXT DOOR THAT HAD IMPLEMENTED THAT LOW PROFILE BULKHEAD, THEY HAD THE GABBY AND SEA WALL, AND THE LOW PROFILE PROFILE BULKHEAD, THERE IS ALMOST NOTHING ON AT THAT POINT THAT THAT GROUND IS, IS SOLID.
SO WE'LL MOVE ON TO PICTURE THREE IN 2017.
THIS IS REALLY WHEN THE WETLANDS AT OUR LOCATION START TO ERODE.
OKAY? UM, MOST OF THE MO, MOST OF THE REAL EXTENSIVE EROSION BEGINS AROUND THIS TIME.
THIS WAS AFTER THE CAPTAIN'S COVE.
HOA SENT THEIR MAINTENANCE CREW, NOT A REGISTERED CONTRACTOR WITH THE STATE OF VIRGINIA MARINE LICENSE.
THEY SENT THEIR MAINTENANCE CREW INTO THE END OF CAPTAIN'S COVE AND HAD THEM REMOVE THIS BREAKWATER.
SO IT WAS AFTER THAT THAT WE HAVE LOST AT LEAST 6,000 SQUARE FEET OF WETLANDS ON OUR PROPERTY SINCE THE 20 16 20 17 TIMEFRAME.
PICTURE NUMBER FOUR IS THE MOST RECENT AERIAL VIEW ON, THAT'S ON THE AKIMA COUNTY GIS.
OKAY? THIS IS ALSO ABOUT THE TIME THAT I PURCHASED THE PROPERTY.
AND I THINK THIS IS THE PHOTO THAT PAUL PROVIDED IN, UH, IN HIS DOCUMENTATION.
SO THIS IS IMPORTANT TO NOTICE BECAUSE IF YOU GO AT PICTURE NUMBER
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FIVE, THAT'S MY WIFE, MY SON AND HIS FRIEND AT OUR PROPERTY.AND YOU CAN SEE THE BEAUTIFUL VEGETATED WETLANDS THAT I HAD IN 2001, 2002, OFF THE SIDE OF OUR PROPERTY.
WE HAD CLAMS, WE HAD MUSSELS, WE HAD CRABS.
IT WAS A, A BEAUTIFUL, BEAUTIFUL PLACE.
SO THIS WAS ABOUT THE TIME THAT I CONTACTED CHUCK WARD AND SAID, WHAT CAN WE DO? BECAUSE I SAW THE WAVES COMING IN.
WE CONTACTED THE COUNTY, WE CONTACTED THE VMRC.
THE VMRC SENT A REPRESENTATIVE OUT FOR A COURTESY VISIT.
HE LOOKED AT IT AND SAID, YOU NEED TO DO SOMETHING QUICK, BECAUSE AT THAT MEETING, HE EXPLAINED TO US THAT THE WETLANDS HAD FORMED A WALL.
SO IT WAS NO LONGER SLOPED GROUND.
AND HE SAID, NOW WHEN THE WAVE ACTION CAME IN, THE EROSION AGAINST THAT WETLANDS WAS GOING TO BE MUCH, MUCH FASTER THAN IT HAD IN THE PAST.
AT THAT POINT, HE SAID, WE SHOULD EXPECT THREE TO FIVE FEET A YEAR OF EROSION.
IF YOU LOOK AT PICTURE NUMBER SIX, THIS IS THE BACKSIDE OF OUR HOUSE.
PRIOR TO THE GNS REMOVED, WE HAD AT LEAST 15 FEET OF FRONTAGE AT THAT LOCATION.
THAT 15 FEET OF FRONTAGE, WHICH WAS PROBABLY WETLANDS, WAS GONE PICTURE SEVEN THROUGH 10.
THIS IS HIGH TIDE AT MY HOUSE TODAY.
THE MAIN AREA THAT PAUL IS POINTING OUT IS KIND OF DEAD CENTER.
THAT IS APPROXIMATELY A 10 BY 10 AREA.
THAT'S THE ONLY AREA THAT HAS NOT STARTED GROWING BACK.
UM, BUT IT WAS DESTROYED BEFORE WE STARTED TO DO ANY OF THIS WORK BECAUSE OF THE EROSION FROM THE WAVES.
THIS IS ON THE BOTTOM OF THE PAGE THAT YOU SEE.
SO, SO THIS HAD ALL BEEN HIT VERY, VERY HARD FROM WAVE ACTIONS BEFORE WE STARTED OUR PROJECT.
OKAY? I HAVE AN EMAIL TO CLAIRE FROM, I WANNA SAY NINE MONTHS BEFORE OUR PROJECT STARTED, WHERE I'M BEGGING THE VMRC TO PLEASE EXPEDITE THE APPROVAL.
BECAUSE IN MY EMAIL TO CLAIRE, I SAY, HALF THE WETLANDS THAT YOU SAW WERE GONE, AND IT STILL TOOK SEVERAL MONTHS TO GET IT.
SO, YOU KNOW, BUT HINDSIGHT'S 2020.
I DON'T, I DON'T WANNA BRING US OLD STUFF, BUT YOU CAN SEE THAT THAT'S UNDERWATER.
AND YOU KNOW, PAUL CAME TO MY HOUSE YESTERDAY AND SAID, WELL, YOU CAN PLANT GRASS THERE.
I'M LIKE, PAUL, IT'S UNDERWATER
OKAY? IT'S NOT GONNA COME BACK UNTIL THE, THE GROUND ACTUALLY IS ELEVATED TO WHERE IT'S NOT UNDERWATER AS MUCH AS, SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE, THE GROUND BEHIND THE LOW PROFILE BULKHEAD, YES, THAT GROUND'S UNDERWATER.
SO THERE'S NO VEGETATION THERE ANYMORE.
OKAY? THAT NEEDS TO BE, HOPEFULLY, YOU KNOW, ONE THING YOU'VE ALWAYS SAID IS THAT THIS WILL EVENTUALLY HAVE DEPOSITS WILL COME IN THE GROUND, WILL COME BACK, AND THEN THE WETLANDS WILL COME BACK.
THE TOP PICTURE WILL SHOW YOU THAT IS AN ELECTRICAL TRANSFORMER THAT IS PART OF THE INFRASTRUCTURE ON STARBOARD STREET THAT IS LAST WEEK AT HIGH TIDE.
OKAY? EVEN WITH THE BERM THAT WE PUT IN, WE STILL DO GET SOME STORM SURGE.
AND THAT IS VERY CLOSE TO, I MEAN, THE WAVES HIT IT, OKAY? BUT AS THE, IF THE EROSION CONTINUES IN THAT SPOT, IT'S ONLY A MATTER OF TIME BEFORE WE START TO HAVE SOME REAL, REAL ISSUES WITH INFRASTRUCTURE.
OKAY? I DO THINK THAT WHAT WE'VE IMPLEMENTED IS HELPING.
OKAY? BUT I DON'T, I DON'T THINK IT'S THE END ALL SOLUTION.
AND THE PICTURE BELOW THAT IS JUST ANOTHER I, ANOTHER PICTURE TO SHOW YOU THAT IS HIGH TIDE AT OUR PROPERTY.
THE WETLANDS THAT WERE THERE ARE GONE BECAUSE OF THE EROSION THAT JUST TOOK PLACE OVER THE YEARS.
PICTURE 12, UM, I LOVE MY WIFE DEARLY.
UM, SHE IS SOMEONE THAT I WOULD AFFECTIONATELY CALL A TREE HUGGER.
OKAY? ONE OF THE REASONS THAT WE DID THIS IS BECAUSE IT, IT BOTHERED HER TO SEE THE GROUND NEXT TO US JUST ERODING AND ERODING.
UM, SO AFTER THE, THE RIP WRAP SEA WALL WAS IMPLEMENTED, UM, SHE DIDN'T LIKE THAT THERE WAS STILL SOME GRAVEL OUT THERE.
SO WE SPENT ABOUT THREE OR FOUR HOURS OUT IN THAT SPOT DIGGING UP THE GRAVEL.
I WILL TELL YOU THAT AT THAT POINT, UM, I GOT SICK BECAUSE I HAD, I HAD ALWAYS KIND OF KNOWN, BUT I DIDN'T REALLY KNOW THE EXTENT.
BUT AS I WAS OUT THERE RAKING AND SHOVELING
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THE SEWAGE, THE SMELL WAS SO OVERWHELMING THAT I, I HAD TO STOP.UM, AND, AND I'VE MENTIONED THIS NUMEROUS TIMES, AND I DON'T THINK IT WAS UNTIL YESTERDAY TO CLAIRE ACTUALLY UNDERSTOOD WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT.
I KNOW IT'S NOT THIS BOARD'S PURVIEW.
BUT I HAVE RAISED ISSUES IN NUMEROUS PLACES ABOUT THE ONGOING FLOODING AND THE SEWAGE POLLUTION FROM EVERY HOME ON STARBOARD STREET.
'CAUSE WE ALL HAVE BASINS AND THEY'RE NOT SEALED.
SO EVERY TIME THE ROAD FLOODS, THE WATER GOES INTO THOSE BASINS.
AND ALL THE SEWAGE THAT'S IN THE LINE ON STARBOARD STREET IS JUST, IT'S SEEPING INTO THE WATER, WHICH THEN GOES AND LAYS ON THIS BEAUTIFUL LAND.
OKAY? SO I AM, AND I WILL GET TO THIS IN A LITTLE BIT, BUT I'M IN THE PROCESS OF DOING MY OWN SOIL TESTING AS WELL AS SENDING SOME REP, SOME REQUESTS OUT TO THE DEQ.
UM, I BELIEVE THAT THE WETLANDS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ARE VERY LIKELY POLLUTED AS WELL.
WE WILL KNOW SOON ENOUGH PICTURES IN 13, 13 AND 14, I THINK THESE SPEAK VOLUMES, PICTURE ON THE LEFT AND PICTURE ON THE RIGHT, THAT'S THE EXACT SAME SPOT.
THAT IS ONLY THREE YEARS DIFFERENCE.
THAT'S HOW BAD THE EROSION WAS.
PICTURES 15 THROUGH 17, THIS SHOWS YOU THAT ONE SMALL AREA.
AND I, I WILL SAY I DON'T UNDERSTAND THIS, UM, BUT SINCE WE'VE IMPLEMENTED THE SEA WALL, WE'RE GETTING GRASSES THAT ACCUMULATE IN THAT SPOT.
I MEAN, YOU CAN SEE THE PICTURE ON THE RIGHT.
I DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT'S WETLANDS GRASS OR IF SOMEONE IS DUMPING GRASS SOMEPLACE, BUT THAT IS COMMON.
AS SOON AS HIGH TIDE GOES DOWN, IF YOU LOOK AT THAT PICTURE ON THE RIGHT, THAT'S COMMON WITH WHAT'S LAYING THERE.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE IT'S COMING FROM.
UM, AND THEN THE NEXT PAGE WILL SHOW YOU THAT EXACT AREA.
THAT'S WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE WHEN THE TIDE GOES OUT, BECAUSE THAT IT IS JUST COVERED IN THAT GRASS.
SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S PROBABLY CONTRIBUTING TO THE STRUGGLE IN THAT AREA AS WELL.
SO THIS IS THE ONE AREA WHERE, I MEAN, I WILL TELL YOU, PAUL AND CLAIRE CAME BY MY HOUSE YESTERDAY.
WE ACTUALLY HAD A REALLY GOOD TALK.
UM, IF, IF THE PAUL THAT SHOWED UP YESTERDAY WOULD'VE BEEN THE SAME PAUL THAT SHOWED UP IN MARCH, UM, I'M NOT SURE THAT I WOULD BE HERE
OKAY? BUT, UH, IN MARCH WHEN I ARRIVED AT THE PROPERTY, IT WAS PRETTY HEATED AT THAT POINT.
I, I ARRIVED ABOUT A HALF HOUR AFTER PAUL AND CLAIRE DID.
AND, UM, THERE WERE THREATS DISCUSSIONS ABOUT HOW I WAS GOING TO BE FINED THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS, UM, FOR WHAT I HAD DONE TO DAMAGE THE WETLANDS.
UM, MY CONTRACTOR AT THE TIME, I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT YOU HAD MULTIPLE ISSUES WITH JEFF AT THAT TIME.
UM, BUT IT, IT WAS, IT WAS A HEATED ARGUMENT.
OKAY? I ATTEMPTED TO EXPLAIN TO PAUL THAT HE WAS COMING IN THE 11TH HOUR ON A PROJECT THAT HAD BEEN GOING ON FOR THREE YEARS.
HE WAS A GOOD GUY YESTERDAY, BUT IN MARCH HE DIDN'T WANT TO HEAR IT.
OKAY? UM, CLAIRE WAS QUIET THAT DAY, BUT CLAIRE HAS NEVER BEEN NOTHING BUT EXTREMELY SUPPORTIVE.
SO, UM, BUT WHAT HAPPENED WAS I PAID FOR AN ADDITIONAL 10 TON OF STONE THAT WAS TO BE PUT ONTO THIS SEAWALL.
BUT BECAUSE OF THE ENVIRONMENT THAT DAY, JEFF LOADED UP HIS TRUCK, TOOK ALL THAT ROCK THAT YOU SAW, LOADED IT UP.
IT WAS ABOUT A HALF A TRUCKLOAD.
HE SAID HE WAS GONNA TRY AND FIND A PLACE TO PUT IT OR TO LOAD IT ONTO HIS BARGE.
SO THE RIP WRAP, SO THAT ADDITIONAL 10 TON, WHICH WOULD REALLY HELP TO ELEVATE THAT AND SECURE THAT AREA WAS NOT IMPLEMENTED.
SO, UM, AND THE LAST PAGE IS, I WENT TO JEFF'S LOCATION 'CAUSE I WAS LOOKING FOR SOMETHING.
AND, UH, THAT HAPPENS TO LOOK LIKE ABOUT 10 TON RIP REP.
OKAY? UM, I DON'T WANNA SPEAK BADLY ABOUT JEFF.
I, I, I MEAN, I WILL TELL YOU, I HAVE NEVER HAD AN ISSUE WITH THE GUY.
I THOUGHT THEY DID GREAT WORK.
UM, YOU KNOW, BUT OBVIOUSLY THIS IS AN ISSUE.
SO WHERE ARE WE TODAY? I, I WOULD HOPE AFTER LOOKING AT THAT, THAT NO ONE IS GOING TO DISAGREE THAT THE EROSION
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AT OUR PROPERTY IS DUE TO THE REMOVAL OF THAT CABIN AND SEA WALL.WE'LL HEAR FROM CLAIRE, ET CETERA, ET CETERA.
UH, AND WE SEE THE PICTURES AND IT'S HELPED A LOT.
BUT, UM, WELCOME TO CAPTAIN'S COVE.
I'VE BEEN THROUGH IT MY WHOLE LIFE.
UH, I'M A BAYSIDE, BUT I'VE BEEN HERE MANY GENERATIONS AND I'VE KNOWN SINCE THEY STARTED THIS THAT CAPTAIN'S COVE WAS GOING AWAY.
WELL, SOME OF US ARE TRYING TO FIX IT, BUT IT'S NOT EASY.
UM, SO I HOPE WE ALL UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, THAT EROSION HAPPENED BEFORE THIS PROJECT.
I MEAN, LOOK AT WHAT HAPPENED JUST FROM THE DAY THAT I STOOD HERE THE FIRST TIME WITH YOU AND WHAT TOOK PLACE BEFORE WE WERE ABLE TO EVEN START THE PROJECT.
UM, I HAVE DONE FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT REQUESTS WITH BOTH THE WETLANDS BOARD AND THE VMRC.
AT NO TIME WAS CAPTAINS COOCH NOTIFIED TO REMOVE THAT ANY OF THE GABON.
AT NO TIME WAS THERE REQUEST, AT NO TIME WAS THERE AN APPROVAL.
UM, AND EVEN AFTER THEY'VE DONE THAT, THERE'S BEEN NO, UM, DISCIPLINARY ACTION AGAINST THEM.
I DON'T KNOW WHETHER THAT'S YOUR PLACE OR TO VM C'S PLACE, BUT I'M SIMPLY STATING IT FOR THE RECORD, THAT THEY DID THIS.
AND THEY DIDN'T EVEN USE A VIRGINIA MARINE CONTRACTOR.
OKAY? UM, THE ONLY AREA THAT'S REALLY STRUGGLING RIGHT NOW IS ABOUT A 10 BY 10 SECTION.
IT WOULD MAKE NO, PAUL SAID PLANT GRASS THERE.
IT WOULD MAKE NO SENSE TO PLANT GRASS THERE BECAUSE IT'S UNDERWATER A LARGE AMOUNT OF TIME.
IF YOU WANT, IF YOU ALLOW, I'M HAPPY TO BRING DIRT IN AND FILL THAT IN.
'CAUSE ONCE IT'S ABOVE WATER, IT'LL PROBABLY GROW.
BUT I'M NOT GONNA DO ANYTHING UNTIL YOU TELL ME I CAN, BECAUSE I DON'T WANT PAUL SHOWING UP AT MY HOUSE SAYING, OH, NOW YOU DUMPED DIRT THERE,
AND SO IF YOUR CONTRACTOR, UH, THAT'S BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR CONTRACTOR, I HOPE YOU ARE AWARE OF THAT.
AS FAR AS THIS BOARD IS CONCERNED.
I'M SIMPLY WANTED YOU TO UNDERSTAND.
UM, SO ANOTHER ISSUE IS, I BELIEVE THE ONGOING FLOODING OF STARBOARD STREET HAS INTRODUCED ENOUGH SEWAGE OVER THE YEARS THAT THESE WETLANDS MAY VERY WELL BE POLLUTED.
AND THAT'S PROBABLY GOING TO HAVE A VERY BIG IMPACT ON IT.
I AM IN THE PROCESS OF DRAFTING COMPLAINTS TO, UH, VIRGINIA'S DEQ TO ASK THEM TO INVESTIGATE.
I AM ALSO DOING MY OWN SOIL SAMPLES AND SENDING THEM OUT TO PRIVATE LABS.
SO YES, OUR CONTRACTOR DID PLACE PLYWOOD DOWN, AND THEY DID USE THAT AS A STAGING AREA.
I WAS TOLD BY CHUCK, BY AARON, BY JEFF, BY ANYONE THAT I TALKED TO THAT WAS COMMONPLACE.
IF IT'S NOT AND IT REQUIRED SOMETHING ELSE IN THE PERMIT, THEN I'M GONNA GO BACK TO MR. WARD AND SAY, CHUCK, HOW COME YOU DIDN'T DO THAT? OKAY, I, I'M TOLD IT'S COMMON PRACTICE.
UM, I WILL TELL YOU THAT WHEN JEFF'S TEAM STARTED, UM, I WAS THERE THE FIRST DAY AND THEY HAD LIKE A DECK THAT WENT OUT OVER TO WETLANDS THAT, UM, 'CAUSE THERE WAS, THERE WAS VEGETATION WHERE THEY FIRST STARTED WORKING, AND THEY DIDN'T EVEN PUT PLYWOOD DOWN.
THEY ACTUALLY PUT LIKE A DOCK OVER TOP OF IT, SO IT WASN'T EVEN LAYING ON THE WETLANDS.
BUT THEN TOWARDS THE END WHERE THEY WERE WORKING INTO ONE SPOT, THERE WAS REALLY NOT ANY VEGETATION THERE.
SO AT THAT SPOT, THEY JUST PUT, UM, PLYWOOD DOWN.
UM, BUT, AND, AND THEY WERE PRETTY, THEY WERE PRETTY DILIGENT THE WHOLE PROJECT UNTIL LIKE THE LAST DAY OR TWO, WHOEVER BROUGHT THAT LAST LOAD IN, HE JUST DUMPED IT.
AND IT DID GO OVER THE EXTENSION OF THE PLYWOOD.
I'M NOT, I DON'T KNOW IF JEFF WAS THERE OR NOT, YOU KNOW, BUT I MEAN, I CERTAINLY WAS NOT OUT THERE PUTTING ROCKS ON THE WETLANDS.
SO, UM, AS I SAID, AFTER, AFTER PAUL HAD VISITED THE SITE, CONTRACT, REMOVED EVERYTHING.
SO, YOU KNOW, IF WE'RE DISCUSSING THE, THE VIOLATION THAT ROCKS WERE PUT THERE, THOSE ROCKS HAVE BEEN REMOVED.
AND I AM TELLING YOU THAT THERE IS NO VEGETATION THAT WAS DESTROYED FROM IT BECAUSE THERE WASN'T VEGETATION THERE BEFORE.
UM, I, I HAVE INVESTED OVER THREE YEARS OF MY LIFE ATTEMPTING TO ADDRESS THE ISSUES OF WETLANDS AND OUR PROPERTY.
I HAVE INVESTED OVER $70,000 OF MY MONEY TO FIX THIS SITUATION.
IT SHOULD HAVE NEVER OCCURRED THAT GABBY AND SEAWALL SHOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN REMOVED.
[00:30:01]
HAS EVEN OBTAINED A RECREATIONAL OYSTER FARM PERMIT FOR THE LOCATION WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.NOT BECAUSE SHE WANTS TO EAT THE OYSTERS, BUT BECAUSE SHE READ THAT IF WE DO THAT, THAT IT'S GONNA HELP CLEAN THE WATER.
UM, AS I SAID, I THINK IT'S, IT'S HEAVILY POLLUTED.
SO, BUT YET IN THIS BOARD'S EYES, SOMEHOW I'M THE CRIMINAL.
I MEAN, PAUL MADE IT VERY CLEAR THAT THIS COMPLAINT AGAINST ME IS A CRIMINAL MISDEMEANOR.
SO, NEXT STEPS, I'D IMAGINE YOU CAN IGNORE OR DISAGREE WITH MY ASSESSMENT AND ASSESS FINES AGAINST ME OR MY CONTRACTOR.
I WILL LIKELY DEFEND MYSELF IN COURT IF THAT'S THE CASE.
UM, I AM A 62-YEAR-OLD DISABLED VETERAN.
I HAVE NEVER HAD AS MUCH AS A TRAFFIC TICKET, AND I'LL DEFINITELY DEFEND MYSELF.
UM, IN THE NEXT TWO WEEKS, I WILL BE FILING FORMAL COMPLAINTS WITH THE DEQ FOR SEWAGE POLLUTION AND THE WETLANDS LOSS.
THE VMRC, THE VDH FOR SEWAGE HEALTH ISSUES, THE ARMY CORPS FOR THE UNPERMITTED, REMOVAL OF A REQUIRED SEA WALL FROM THEIR ORIGINAL PLANS, THE EPA REGARDING WATER QUALITY AND FEMA REGARDING FLOODING AND N-P-N-F-I-P COMPLIANCE, I REALIZE THAT WE, WE CAN DISAGREE.
I, I, I THINK THIS BOARD PROBABLY HAS SOME ENFORCEMENT ABILITY.
UM, BUT I DO REALIZE THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT THE ISSUES HERE ARE WAY BEYOND, UM, ANYTHING THAT THIS BOARD CAN DO.
UM, BUT I WILL REQUEST THAT WITH YOUR VAST KNOWLEDGE AND HAVING DEALT WITH CAPTAIN'S CO FOR YEARS, THAT IF ANY OF THESE DO RESULT IN INVESTIGATIONS, I WOULD REQUEST THAT THIS BOARD WOULD WILLINGLY ASSIST.
SO I RESPECTFULLY REQUEST THAT THE CHARGE AGAINST ME BE DISMISSED.
ANYTHING ELSE? NO, I THINK THAT'S IT.
UH, ANYONE ON THIS BOARD HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THIS GENTLEMAN BEFORE WE HEAR FROM EVERYONE ELSE? I DO THINK YOUR WIFE IS CORRECT.
NOT JUST ABOUT THES, BUT ABOUT THE, UH, GRAVEL ON THERE.
THAT'S PROBABLY, IF YOU DIDN'T NOTICE ANY GRASS GROWING ANYWAY, BECAUSE THE GRASS IS GROWING BACK.
SO IT'S NOT GONNA GROW THROUGH THE GRAVEL.
THAT'S, YOU SEE THAT, THAT WAS FROM THEN.
BUT HAVE YOU NOTICED ANY, UH, GROWTH SINCE THE GRAVEL'S BEEN REMOVED? A LITTLE BIT, BUT IT'S, IT'S REALLY ON THE EDGE OF THAT.
SO THE AREA THAT'S UNDERWATER, THAT'S STRUGGLING BECAUSE ONE, IT'S UNDERWATER, BUT TWO, THAT GRASS IS ACCUMULATING THERE.
AND I'VE GONE OUT AND, AND RAKED IT A FEW TIMES.
I'M LIKE, I CAN'T EVEN KEEP AHEAD OF IT.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE IT'S COMING FROM.
DID THE REMOVAL OF THE GRAVEL SINK IT DOWN MORE TILL WHERE YOU HAD UH, NOT REALLY.
BUT I THINK SHE'S A HUNDRED PERCENT RIGHT.
AND LIKE I SAID, THIS PICTURE, THE 2002 EXPLAINS, LIKE I SAID, WE SEE THE GRAVEL.
WE'RE THINKING IT'S JUST, UH, REMNANTS FROM THE, FROM THE, UH, COSTONE THAT WAS PUT THERE.
THAT'S, THAT WAS GRAVEL WAS ALREADY THERE.
NO, WELL, I, I'LL TELL YOU WHAT REALLY HAPPENED.
WHAT REALLY HAPPENED IN THAT SPOT WAS I'VE HAD GRAVEL ON MY DRIVEWAY FOR YEARS AND I HAD A LITTLE BERM AT THE END JUST REALLY TO STOP PEOPLE FROM DRIVING OVER THE EDGE.
UM, AND IT NEVER, EVER, EVER GOT INTO THE MARSH.
AND THEN JUST PRIOR TO, UM, YOU KNOW, A COUPLE MONTHS PRIOR, THE, THE SEA WATER, THE, THE WAVE ACTION DURING A STORM FINALLY GOT TO THE GRAVEL BURN.
AND AT THAT ONE SPOT, THAT'S WHERE IT WENT THROUGH.
AND THAT'S THE STUFF THAT MY WIFE HAD ME CLEAN UP.
BUT, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, THERE AIN'T EVEN ANYTHING I CAN DO ABOUT THAT.
I MEAN, IT TOOK YEARS, BUT IT FINALLY GOT TO THE STREET AND, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, YEAH, THE GRAVEL WAS PART OF IT, BUT I'M MORE CONCERNED ABOUT THE ELECTRICAL INFRASTRUCTURE, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU.
I MEAN, THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH US.
BUT YOU ARE GONNA HAVE TO GO TO A-A-N-E-C, AT LEAST PUT AN EXTENSION ON THAT LITTLE, THAT LITTLE LOW EXTENSION DOOR.
AT LEAST PUT A HOT EXTENSION ON THAT.
WELL, AND THEN YOU'RE GONNA HAVE PROBLEMS THERE.
AND THEN THE OTHER THING IS, AND I WISH TIM WAS HERE, BUT YOU KNOW, I, I, I, I FINALLY, YOU KNOW, I I, I TOOK CLAIRE AND PAUL TO OUR NEXT DOOR NEIGHBOR'S HOUSE YESTERDAY.
AND I SHOWED 'EM, I SAID, EVERY HOME ON STARBOARD STREET, WE HAVE PUBLIC SEWER.
SO THINK OF LIKE A TRASH CAN THAT'S DUG INTO THE GROUND AND THEN EVERYONE HAS A MACERATOR PUMP IN THERE.
WELL, THOSE THINGS AREN'T SEALED, THEY JUST HAVE A LITTLE COVER ON TOP.
SO EVERY TIME THAT STREET FLOODS, THE SEA WATER GETS INTO THERE.
[00:35:01]
THE SEWAGE FROM THAT HOUSE BECAUSE THAT'S TIED DIRECTLY INTO THE MAIN SEWER LINE.IT GOES ALL THE WAY UP STARBOARD STREET.
SO WHERE, WHERE, WHERE EVERY TIME THAT FLOODS, THAT IS INTRODUCING POLLUTES.
I DO HAVE ONE MORE QUESTION, YOUR HONOR, PLEASE.
UH, UH, DID YOU HAPPEN TO TAKE PICTURES THIS MORNING? 'CAUSE THE TILE WAS WAY OUT THIS MORNING, IF YOU NOTICED.
I WAS RUNNING, I KNOW, I'M SORRY.
BUT I MAY ASK YOU THE QUESTION.
LIKE I SAY, THOSE, THOSE, UH, ON A, ON A TIDE LIKE THIS MORNING AND A, WE CALL IT A BLOWOUT TIDE.
UM, DOES, DOES LOW, DOES SHOULD LOW WATER GO TO THE, UH, THE, UH, QUARRY THING? NO.
SO IT'S ON, IT'S ON, ON VMR? NO, IT'S, THAT'S WHY, THAT WAS MY QUESTION.
AND ACTUALLY I GOT IN AN ARGUMENT WITH THE HOA OVER THAT.
ANYONE ELSE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE MOMENT? I'D JUST LIKE TO SAY ONE THING, SIR, AND THEN WE'LL, PLEASE DON'T LEAVE US, WE'LL WANT YOU BACK.
UM, WAS THAT, UH, A EC UH, BOX THERE WHEN YOU PURCHASED THE PROPERTY? YES.
AND, UM, MAYBE THIS GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH IT, BUT I'M GONNA ASK IT ANYWAY.
UH, YOU DIDN'T BUY THIS PROPERTY SITE UNSEEN.
YOU OBVIOUSLY KNEW CAPTAIN'S COVE BEFORE YOU PURCHASED THE PROPERTY.
WELL,
BUT YOU KNOW, IF YOU LOOK AT THAT ONE PICTURE YES, SIR.
WITH MY WIFE AND EVERYTHING, I MEAN, WE HAD PLENTY OF LAND OVER THERE.
I NEVER IMAGINED THAT IN THREE OR FOUR YEARS THAT WOULD ENTIRELY BE GONE.
I MEAN, THAT'S JUST, THAT'S AMAZING.
SO, UH, DON'T LEAVE US, PLEASE.
UH, I'D LIKE, UH, PAUL, YOU'VE BEEN SWORN IN.
WOULD YOU, UH, CARRY ON THE SAME TOPIC? UM, YES.
I'VE GOT, UH, I GUESS FOUR THINGS I'D LIKE TO BRING UP.
UH, FIRST ON MARCH, I BELIEVE IT WAS MARCH 17 WHEN WE VISITED THE SITE AND SAW THE ROCKS ON THE MARSH.
UM, UH, IT WAS JUST, UH, MS. GORMAN, UH, AND BETH, UH, HOW, UH, AND MR. BROWN THERE, WHATEVER DEFICIENCY MR. BROWN MAY HAVE AS A MARINE CONTRACTOR, HE IS VERY PLEASANT TO DEAL WITH.
AND THERE WAS NO RAISED VOICES OR ANYTHING.
UM, AND I WOULD LIKE TO TELL THE BOARD THAT I EMPHASIZED TO MR. PULASKI THAT DAY, THAT THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF THIS PROJECT ORIGINALLY WAS TO PROTECT THIS MARSH.
AND THAT WHILE I COULD NOT SPEAK FOR THE BOARD, I WOULD CERTAINLY BE SUPPORTIVE OF A REMEDY HERE OF THE MARSH BEING RESTORED.
AND THAT, THAT WAS ALL I PERSONALLY THOUGHT.
I MEAN, IN MY OPINION, AS I WAS SITTING THERE, I THOUGHT THAT WOULD BE AN ADEQUATE SOLUTION.
OF COURSE, THE BOARD WOULD MAKE THE FINAL CALL, BUT I EMPHASIZED THAT TO HIM REPEATEDLY AS OPPOSED TO ANY OTHER TYPE OF DRASTIC MEASURE AGAINST HIM.
AND I TRIED TO EMPHASIZE TO HIM, THAT'S ALL YOU WERE TRYING TO DO IN THE FIRST PLACE.
AND THAT'S ALL I, AND YOU KNOW, AS FAR AS I PERSONALLY HAVE A POSITION THAT I WOULD SUPPORT, I THINK THAT WOULD BE AN APPROPRIATE SOLUTION IN THIS CASE.
UM, AND THAT WAS ACTUALLY TWO DIFFERENT POINTS.
THE THIRD ONE IS THAT, UM, IF YOU LOOK AT PICTURE NUMBER 12, WHICH IS A PRETTY RECENT PICTURE, HIS HIS NUMBER 12.
AND I GUESS THIS PICTURE RIGHT HERE, OR ANY ONE OF THESE PICTURES SHOWING WHERE THE ROCKS WERE PLACED, IT, I, I DON'T SEE A PICTURE IN HERE OF, OF THE CONDITION OF THE MARSH.
YOU KNOW, THE DAY BEFORE, THE MONTH BEFORE.
MAYBE I MISSED IT, OF, OF, OF WHAT HAPPENED HERE.
BUT I, IT DOES NOT SEEM LIKE IT'S A COINCIDENCE THAT THE SAME EXACT LOCATION THAT ALL THIS ROCK WAS PILED ON IS NOW THE LOW LOCATION IN THE MARSH WHERE THERE IS NO MARSH GRASS GROWING.
OBVIOUSLY, IF YOU'RE GONNA LOAD UP THE MARSH WITH ALL OF THIS RIP WRAP, IT'S GOING TO, AND, AND THEN YOU'RE GONNA HAVE YOUR CONTRACTOR WHO PUT IT THERE, YOU KNOW, DIG IT BACK OUT.
THAT'S GONNA BE THE LOW POINT.
SO I, IT, OF COURSE, THIS IS UP TO THE BOARD.
I'M JUST MAKING THE GENERAL POINT THAT IT DOES SEEM LIKE PUTTING THE ROCK THERE.
DID, UM, AT LEAST HAVE SOMETHING TO, TO DO WITH THE, THE GROUND LEVEL OF THAT EXACT SPOT NOW.
UM, AND ACTUALLY, UM, AND THAT'S ALL I HAD TO SAY IN RESPONSE.
UH, FOR THE MOMENT, OKAY, I, I'VE GOT A QUESTION CALL PLEASE.
UM, AT THE LAST MEETING, WHICH WAS TWO MONTHS AGO, I THOUGHT, UH, MR. BRITTON, WHO WAS HERE, UH, MR. BROWN? NO, UH, MR. BRITTON WAS ALSO HERE.
AND HE THOUGHT THAT THEY COULD MAKE THIS GO AWAY
[00:40:01]
BASICALLY BY SPRINGING IT AND BRINGING THE ELEVATION UP.AND I THOUGHT THAT'S WHERE WE WERE HEADED.
UH, SO I'M NOT SURE WHAT CHANGED, WHY THAT DIDN'T I, WHY THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN.
IT'S, I'M NOT EXACTLY SURE WHAT THE BUSINESS RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN MR. BROWN, MR. LUKE BRITTON, AND MR. RAYMOND BRITTON IS MM-HMM
UM, I, I BELIEVE WHEN YOU SAY MR. BRITTON, YOU'RE REFERRING TO RAYMOND BRITTON.
AND, AND I DO RECALL THAT I DO NOT HAVE ANY, I'VE HAD NO INDICATION THAT HE'S HAD ANY INVOLVEMENT IN THAT'S, UH, AT, AT, AT, AT ALL.
UM, WHAT WHAT I REMEMBER IS, UH, MR. BRITTON, JUNIOR BRITTON WAS GOING TO CONTACT THE, THE APPLICANT AND TRY TO WORK THIS, WORK THIS OUT.
I, I, I DO RECALL HIM SAYING THAT I HAVE NOT HAD ANY COMMUNICATION WITH HIM OR MR. PULASKI THAT THAT ACTUALLY TOOK PLACE.
HE USUALLY CALLS ME AND HAD NO WORD FROM HIM.
BUT HE MADE IT CLEAR RIGHT HERE THAT HE WAS GOING TO MAKE IT GO AWAY, AS YOU SAY, I DON'T KNOW THE EXACT TERMINOLOGY, BUT HE TURNED AROUND AND YES, SIR.
UH, I MIGHT, I HATE TO SPEND MR. POLOWSKI'S MONEY AND I KNOW HE'S GONNA HAVE TO GET A PERMIT TO DO IT, BUT LIKE, LIKE HIS WIFE SAID, REMOVE THE GRAVEL AND THE LOW SPOTS PLANT A HUNDRED SAND REPLANT.
AND THAT YOU TO DO THAT, I THINK WE, I THINK US AS A BOARD WOULD BE DIFFICULT TO DEATH TO USE THAT AS TO FIX, I KNOW I'M STILL SPENDING YOU MONEY, BUT IN ORDER FOR US, WE CAN'T JUST TELL YOU TO PUT THE SAND OVER THERE BECAUSE THAT WASN'T PART OF THE ORIGINAL PERMIT.
YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M SAYING? AND YOU HAVE SPEND YOUR MONEY, YOU GOTTA GO THROUGH THE WHOLE PROCESS.
BUT I THINK WE WOULD BE VERY SUPPORT.
LIKE I SAID, WE DIDN'T WANNA LOSE MARSH EITHER.
IT'S NOT TO FIND YOU, IT'S NO NET LOSS.
SO LIKE YOU SAY, AND I THINK LIKE YOU SAID, THOSE SPOTS, YOU SAY WHY PLANT IT THERE? YOU'RE RIGHT.
'CAUSE IT'S LIKE YOU SAY SEA LEVEL RISE ARE GONNA KEEP ON GOING BUT NOT FEEL IT REAL HIGH.
BUT A HUNDRED PERCENT SAYING THE LEVEL THE OTHER, BECAUSE YOU SEE THE MARSHES COMING BACK, YOU CAN SEE THAT AND YOU, AND YOU THINK IT IS COMING BACK IMPRESSIVELY, I THINK, YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? SO, BUT THE OTHER PLACES THAT ARE LOW, YOU STILL NEED TO PLANT THERE BECAUSE IT'S ALREADY BELOW.
BUT LIKE I SAY, IF YOU PUT SOME HUNDRED SIZE BACK AT THE SAME LEVEL AS THE, THAT MARSH, THE, THE MARSH TODAY IN FRONT OF OUR PROPERTY IS STRONGER AND HEALTHIER AND RICHER AND DENSER THAN IT WAS SIX MONTHS AGO.
SO MY QUESTION YOU, LIKE I SAID, I THINK THE ANSWER IS, YEAH, I WANT IT, LIKE I SAY, IF, IF YOU WERE TO GET A PERMIT TO PUT THE, MAKE IT ALL LEVEL, PUT THE A HUNDRED FIFTH SAND THERE AND REPLANT IT, HOPEFULLY IT WOULD ALL GROW BACK.
BECAUSE LIKE I SAID, SO IF I, IF I COULD COMMENT ON BRI, UM, COME UP HERE.
I, I YOU'RE WO IN PLANNING ON BEING STILL.
SO SORRY, START FROM THE BEGINNING.
YOU'RE NOW GONNA SPEAK OF MR. JUNIOR BRIT.
WELL, I GUESS THAT SITUATION ON, SO, YOU KNOW, FIRST OF ALL, I WAS PLANNING ON BEING HERE LAST MONTH.
UM, BUT MY WIFE'S CAR BROKE DOWN THE NIGHT BEFORE AND I HAD TO DRIVE THE PA.
IF YOU WANT, I CAN GET YOU TO TOW REPORT 'CAUSE I HAD TO HAVE HER CAR TOWED.
WE DON'T CARE ABOUT THAT, SIR.
UM, I RECEIVED A CALL FROM JEFF BROWN AND HE SAID, IF I PLAN THAT THIS CAN GO AWAY.
AND I SAID, WHAT'S THAT MEAN? HE GOES, WELL, I TALKED TO BETH AND FOR 800 HOURS SHE CAN DO A PLAN.
AND I'M LIKE, YOU KNOW, YOU GOTTA BE KIDDING ME.
I'VE ALREADY PUT $70,000 INTO THIS PROJECT AND I, IF I AGREE TO SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THEN PAUL'S COMING OUT TO MY HOUSE FOR THREE YEARS.
AND WHAT IF IT DOESN'T GROW? OKAY.
I I MEAN I I, I'M KIND OF DONE SPENDING MONEY ON THIS, YOU KNOW, I, AND I DIDN'T, I DIDN'T PULL THE LEVER ON THE DUMP TRUCK, YOU KNOW, I UNDERSTAND.
FIRST OF ALL, WE HAVEN'T HAD A PROJECT LIKE THIS IN MY X NUMBER OF YEARS HERE.
THAT WE DIDN'T HAVE A PROGRAM FOR THREE TO FIVE YEARS.
THAT IT WAS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO CHECK THAT IT WAS GROWING AND IF NOT, FIND A WAY TO MAKE IT GROW OR COME TO US AGAIN OR SOMETHING.
THAT'S WHAT, SO THAT'S, THAT'S PAUL'S TYPICAL OF THIS BOARD.
AND UH, AS YOU MENTIONED IN REEL OFF ALL THE PEOPLE THAT YOU'RE WILLING TO SUE.
UH, THAT'S TOTALLY UP TO YOU, SIR.
IT'S A FREE COUNTRY, BUT I'M NOT SUING.
UM, BUT WE'VE HAD A PROGRAM EVERY TIME BAYSIDE AND SEASIDE.
I'VE BEEN TO 'EM MANY, MANY TIMES.
UH, YOU MENTIONED THE PLYWOOD, EVEN THE REGROWTH OF THAT MM-HMM
AFTER X NUMBER OF MONTHS OR A YEAR, IF IT HASN'T STARTED TO GROW BACK, YOU FIND A WAY TO MAKE IT GROW.
SO ANYWAY, WE'RE GONNA HEAR FROM MS. GORMAN.
ANYTHING ELSE FOR THIS GENTLEMAN BEFORE HE SEES DON'T LEAVE US, PLEASE.
I'M GONNA HAVE THIS LADY COME RIGHT UP HERE.
MAY I SWEAR YOU IN? DO YOU FIRMLY SWEAR YOU'LL TELL THE TRUTH, WHOLE TRUTH, NOTHING
[00:45:01]
BUT THE TRUTH IN ALL MATTERS BEFORE THIS BOARD? I DO.UH, WE'D LIKE YOUR VERSION, UH, GOING BACK TO YOUR FIRST VISITING THE UH, UH, AREA AND WITH MR. WATSON.
UH, FIRST VISITING AFTER THE SILL HAD CONSTRUCTION HAD STARTED FROM THE ORIGINAL VISIT.
UM, SO WE ISSUED, WE RECEIVED AN A, AN APPLICATION FOR A REVETMENT AND A BREAKWATER IN 2023 SUBMITTED BY CHUCK WARD.
UM, FOR MR. PULASKI, IT WAS ACTUALLY TWO APPLICATIONS 'CAUSE IT WAS TWO SEPARATE PARCELS.
UH, WE WORKED WITH CS AND VIMS TO COME UP WITH A PLAN THAT WOULD WORK, THAT WOULD BE EFFECTIVE HERE.
UM, THERE WAS SOME BACK AND FORTH ON THAT AND IT TOOK A WHILE FOR IT TO GET PERMITTED.
AND THEN WE RECEIVED CALLS ABOUT THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE SILL BECAUSE THE ROCK HAD BEEN PLACED IN THE WETLANDS.
PAUL AND I WENT OUT ON SITE AND YOU SAW THE PHOTOS.
UM, AND BEYOND THAT, I DON'T REALLY HAVE ANY OTHER COMMENTS OTHER THAN THAT.
I'VE WORKED WITH PAUL FOR FOUR YEARS AND I HAVE NEVER SEEN HIM BE ANYTHING BUT PROFESSIONAL TO ANY HOMEOWNER.
UM, SO I DID WANT TO PUT THAT ON THE RECORD, BUT THAT'S, UNLESS YOU HAVE ANY OTHER SPECIFIC QUESTIONS, I DON'T HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL COMMENTS.
ANY QUESTIONS FOR MS. GORMAN, PLEASE? YEAH, I, I'VE GOT ONE OR TWO.
UM, THE AREA THAT'S IN QUESTION HERE, THAT'S HAS NOT, UH, THE VEGETATION HASN'T GROWN BACK.
I'M LOOKING AT PICTURE 12 OF, OF THE APPLICANT'S, UH MM-HMM
UM, THAT AREA ITSELF DOES LOOK LIKE IT'S BEEN DEPRESSED BECAUSE OF THE WEIGHT THAT WAS ON IT.
UH, BY BRINGING IT UP PROBABLY FOUR INCHES, UH, SOMETHING LIKE THAT, WHATEVER THE ELEVATION ON THE, THE SIDES THAT'S, UH, GROWING THE VEGETATION.
UM, AND THEN SPRINGING IT, UH, OUTSIDE, WOULD WE HAVE, WOULD THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH A JPA FOR THAT OR, OR COULD WE JUST GET A, UH, SOME TYPE OF MITIGATION PLAN FOR THAT? A RESTORATION OR MITIGATION PLAN SHOULD BE SUFFICIENT ALREADY.
SO WE'RE NOT HAVE DIRECTED A-J-P-A-I THINK SINCE THERE WAS ALREADY AN APPLICATION, I THINK A RESTORATION PLAN AND ASSOCIATION WITH THAT APPLICATION IS APPROPRIATE.
SO WE, IF WE GOT A RESTORATION PLAN, UH, THAT WAS APPROPRIATE, LIKE WE'VE DONE IN THE PAST WITH A, WITH A THREE YEAR MONITORING, THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD BE IT.
I THINK THAT'S, WE WOULDN'T HAVE TO DO A JPA THAT'S, THAT WAS JUST ANOTHER EXPENSE IS WHAT I WAS WONDERING.
UM, THE, THE CORPS OF ENGINEERS, UH, REQUIRED SEAWALL, UH, THAT WAS ON BM C'S PROPERTY ON STATE OWNED BOTTOM.
THE GAON, THE GAON WALL, YEAH.
LIKE YOU SAID, THEY, UH, I KNOW THEY DIDN'T, THEY GET A PERMIT TO REMOVE THAT FOR SOME REASON, I'M NOT.
SO REMOVAL OF STRUCTURES ON STATE AND BOTTOM DOES NOT REQUIRE THE SUBMISSION OF AN APPLICATION OR A PERMIT OR NOTIFICATION.
SO I'M NOT AWARE OF ANY SORT OF, SORT OF CORRESPONDENCE REGARDING THE GA BEYOND WALL REMOVAL.
SO WHY WOULD, UM, THAT'S NOT SO THAT THIS BACK TO THE, UH, UH, MR. PKIS SAYING WHY, WHY DOES ANYBODY JUST HAVE THE RIGHT TO GO REMOVE A, A SEAWALL THAT WAS REQUIRED BY THE, BY THE CORPS OF ENGINEERS? YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? DON'T HAVE ANY, I HAVE NO, I JUST GO OUT THERE, DON'T IT, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? YOU JUST GO OUT THERE AND, BECAUSE NATURALLY THAT CAUSED A LOT.
IT WAS A BREAK ORDER, BIG TIME BREAK ORDER.
AND THEN IT CAUSED, IT CAUSED THE, IT CAUSED THE ISSUES.
NOT, NOT A LOT OF THE ISSUES THAT I HAVE.
I I, IT DOESN'T REQUIRE AN APPLICATION OR NOTIFICATION TO REMOVE STRUCTURES LIKE THAT.
SO TO THE INSTALLATION OF STRUCTURES DOES REQUIRE APPLICATION AND REVIEW AND PERMITTING, BUT THE REMOVAL DOES NOT.
SO YOU'RE SAYING ANYBODY CAN JUST GO OUT THERE AND TAKE WAGES FOR WHATEVER REASON THEY WANT.
I'M NOT SAYING THAT THEY SHOULD, BUT IT DOESN'T REQUIRE AN ALLOCATION.
WELL, PERFECT EXAMPLE IS THE, THE STONE THAT'S OUT THERE NOW, THEY CAN REMOVE THAT TOMORROW WITHOUT A PERMIT.
UM, WHAT I REMEMBER WITH THE GIAN BASKETS, AND YOU KNOW, THIS IS 15, 20 YEARS AGO, WAS THAT THE GIAN THE BASKET ITSELF WAS RUSTING OUT AND THE THAT'S CORRECT.
THE STONE WAS STARTING TO FALL OUT AND THERE WAS SOME ISSUE ABOUT SAFETY BECAUSE OF ALL OF THE WIRE.
THAT'S KIND OF HOW I REMEMBER IT.
THERE IS A PROVISION IN, UM, IN CHAPTER 12 THAT DOES REQUIRE THE, UH, REMOVAL OF STRUCTURES THAT ARE IN DISREPAIR.
SO IF THAT'S THE CASE MM-HMM
THEN THEY, THEY WOULD'VE BEEN, UM, WELL WITHIN THEIR RIGHTS TO REMOVE IT.
IT'S BEEN MORE CURRENT THAN THAT.
[00:50:01]
THAT, UH, IT, THAT IT HAD ALL FALLEN OUT.UH, THE WIRE WAS STICKING UP AND THEY REMOVED IT, NO PERMIT REQUIRED.
THAT'S KIND OF WHAT I REMEMBER.
UH, SO EVEN THOUGH, UH, MAYBE IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN REPLACED, I DON'T KNOW.
IT'S OUT OF OUR HANDS OUT OF YOURS, I GUESS.
UM, I'M NOT AWARE OF ANY APPLICATIONS FOR REPLACING THAT.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MS. GORMAN? ALRIGHT.
WOULD YOU CARE TO OFFER SOMETHING ELSE? YES, SIR.
SO, UH, JUST A, A FEW COMMENTS.
UM, MR. PULASKI, I APOLOGIZE,
UH, YOU'RE, I JUST WANT TO COMMENT ON YOUR, WHAT YOU JUST SAID.
IF SOMETHING WAS IN A STATE OF DISREPAIR.
UM, I'VE REVIEWED THE PERMITS FROM 1990 AND 1993, WHICH WERE TO ADDRESS ADDITIONAL GABBY AND SEAWALL IMPLEMENTED AT CAPTAIN'S COVE.
THEY WERE NOT THE SEAWALLS AT THE END OF STARBOARD STREET.
AND IN THERE, IN THOSE PERMITS, WHICH WAS, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS A QUID PRO QUO.
CAPTAIN'S COVE AGREED, OH, WE'RE GOING TO PUT THESE GABIONS IN, IT'S GONNA SAVE THE SEA WALL, AND IN RETURN YOU'RE GONNA ALLOW US TO BUILD ON THESE 20 LOTS.
SO THEY GOT TO BUILD ON THE 20 LOTS.
BUT IN THEIR PERMIT, THERE WAS A MONITORING PROGRAM.
AND THE MONITORING PROGRAM CLEARLY SAYS THEY ARE GOING TO BE MONITORED AND THEY'RE GOING TO BE REPAIRED OR REPLACED.
NEVER SAID THAT THEY COULD BE REMOVED, REPAIRED, OR REPLACED.
SO I DO HAVE PICTURES FROM THAT TIMEFRAME OF VARIOUS PERMITS THAT SHOW THE STATE OF THOSE GABIONS, THEY WERE NOT IN A STATE OF DISREPAIR.
AND IF THEY WERE, THEN I HAVE A QUESTION.
WHY ARE THERE STILL GIAN SEA BASKETS ARE STILL GABBING BASKETS OFF THE ENTIRE WALL OF, UM, ING STREET? YOU GO THERE TODAY, YOU CAN TAKE PICTURES OF GAON THAT HAVE BEEN THERE SINCE, SINCE THE NINETIES.
ALL I CAN SAY IS ON THE BAY SIDE WHERE I'VE BEEN MANY, MANY YEARS, WE HAVE SOME OF THE SAME SITUATIONS, MOSTLY DOWN TO COUNTY THAT THEY JUST RIP APART.
I THINK IT'S VERY SIMILAR TO YOU LEAVE CRAIG POTS ON YOUR DOCK SURE.
AND YOU'LL FIND ONE OUTTA 10 THAT'S GONE AWAY.
NO, I, I'M SIMPLY SAYING, I HAVE PICTURES THAT SHOW THEY WEREN'T IN A STATE OF DISREPAIR IN AREAS WHERE THEY WERE REMOVED.
SO, UM, BUT, BUT THAT'S REGARDLESS.
UM, I JUST DID A, A, A LITTLE BIT OF QUICK MATH, THE AREA THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, WHICH I AM TELLING YOU, THERE WAS NO VEGETATION THERE, WHICH IS ONE OF THE REASONS WHY THEY USED THAT SPOT.
BUT IF FOR SOME REASON YOU DON'T BELIEVE ME, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A 10 BY 10 AREA.
SO IF YOU FIND ME $18 A SQUARE FOOT FOR THAT 10 BY 10 AREA, THAT'S ABOUT AN $1,800 FINE.
IF I GO THE OTHER ROUTE OF DOING A PLAN, BRINGING IN DIRT AND PLANTING SEEDS, I'M OVER 1800 HOURS OR AT ABOUT 1800 HOURS.
AND I HAVE A PLAN THAT YOU'RE GONNA COME IN AND MONITOR ME FOR THREE YEARS.
AND, YOU KNOW, WHAT HAPPENS IF IT'S POLLUTED AND IT DOESN'T GROW? SO, YOU KNOW, I, I'M IN A QUANDARY HERE.
I'M, I'M TEMPTED TO SAY, YOU KNOW, I'VE ASKED YOU TO DISMISS IT BECAUSE I'VE CLEARLY SAID THAT.
I MEAN, I'M THE PERSON THAT LIVES THERE.
I KIND OF KNOW WHAT IT LOOKED LIKE.
THE GRAVEL THAT WAS THERE HAS BEEN REMOVED.
UM, BUT, YOU KNOW, IF, IF YOU'RE GOING TO ASK ME TO CHOOSE BETWEEN A FINE OF 1800 HOURS OR WORK FOR $1,800, YOU KNOW, HATE TO SAY IT, I CHOOSE THE FINE.
NUMBER, NUMBER ONE, IT'S NOT SEED, YOU'LL BE TRANSPLANTING.
AND, UH, SECONDLY, UH, ONCE AGAIN, THE MONITORING PLAN IS IN PLACE NO MATTER WHAT.
WHETHER YOU CHOOSE TO DO IT ON YOUR OWN OR YOU'RE FORCED TO BAYSIDE AND SEASIDE, THERE'S ALWAYS A MONITORING PLAN, EVEN IF IT'S UH, UH, EVEN IF YOU CHOOSE TO MAKE UPLANDS INTO WETLANDS TO COMPENSATE FOR THE LOST WETLANDS IN CERTAIN SITUATIONS, THERE'S A MONITORING PLAN.
SO THAT'S I THINK PART OF LIFE IF YOU CHOOSE.
WHEN WE, IF I COULD INTERJECT PLEASE.
THE 18 YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT WOULD'VE BEEN AN IN FEE, WHICH IS ACTUALLY NOT USED ANYMORE AS OF I THINK MAYBE FEBRUARY, MARCH.
AND NOW YOU HAVE TO GO INTO THE OPEN MARKET AND BUY CREDITS.
AND I THINK THEY RANGE ANYWHERE FROM MAYBE A LOW OF 25 TO AN UPPER LIMIT OF 40 PLUS.
UM, SO I JUST WANTED TO MAKE YOU AWARE OF THAT.
SO IT'S INTERESTING BECAUSE IF YOU, I'M NOT SURE HOW GOOD YOUR MEMORY IS, BUT
[00:55:01]
WHEN I FIRST CAME HERE, I WANTED TO RESTORE THIS WHOLE AREA AND CREATE A BANK.NO, I KNOW, UH, OF THE MITIGATION BANK VERSUS RESTORATION, ET CETERA.
UH, FIRST OF ALL, I'D LIKE TO, UH, ASK IF THERE'S ANYONE ELSE HERE THAT WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT.
ONLY, UM, I DON'T KNOW IF IT HELPS ABOUT JONATHAN MUD MUDS MARINE CONSTRUCTION.
UH, DO YOU SWEAR AFFIRM THAT YOU'LL TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? YES.
UM, THE TIMEFRAME THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, WHEN THEY REMOVED THOSE, THE CAGES WERE FALLING APART 'CAUSE THEY ACTUALLY ASKED ME TO BID ON REMOVING THEM.
SO I DON'T KNOW IF THAT HELPS OR DOESN'T ANY KIND OF CLARITY AT ALL.
BUT THAT WHAT THE PROBLEM WAS, THE CAGES WERE FALLING APART AND THE STONES WERE FALLING UP OUT OF 'EM.
DID YOU, UH, GO OUT THERE AND LOOK AT IT BEFORE YOU DID? I ACTUALLY BUILT A PIER RIGHT ALONGSIDE OF 'EM AND THEY WERE ALL FALLING APART AND I BUILT A WALL ON A PIER RIGHT ALONGSIDE OF ONE OF THE, YEAH, THERE WAS WIRES STICKING UP ALL OVER EVERYWHERE.
I'M NOT ON ANYBODY'S SIDE HERE.
I UNDERSTAND THAT SIR, BY THIS TO, UH, THE, I GUESS IT'S SOUTH END.
DO YOU REMEMBER THAT SPECIFICALLY? YEP.
I DON'T FOR LONG, ADAM, SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
UH, ANYONE ELSE ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT OR JPA WISH TO SPEAK? LIKE TO CLOSE THE FLOOR, OPEN IT TO PUBLIC COMMENT, NO PUBLIC COMMENT, CLOSE THE FLOOR.
OPEN IT UP TO BOARD DISCUSSION.
HANK, PLEASE WOULD YOU
THAT'S, UH, SO WE, WE COME DOWN TO EITHER ACCEPTING WHAT IS HERE NOW AND HOPEFULLY IT WOULD GROW BACK OR WE DO SOME TYPE OF, UH, RESTORATION PLAN, UH, WHICH IS, I'M MORE INCLINED TO BE HEADING THAT DIRECTION.
UH, WHICH WOULD JUST, THESE RESTORATION PLANS ARE ONLY ABOUT A PAGE AND THERE SO MUCH OF IT AS COOKIE CUTTER.
UH, AND, UM, SO I, I THINK I'M HEADING IN THAT DIRECTION AT THIS POINT.
UM, UNLESS SOMEBODY ELSE CAN, UH, NO THANK YOU.
I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM, I AGREE WITH MR. HANK.
HOWEVER, MR. TAYLOR, ONE THING, IT'S GOTTA BE TAKEN CARE OF.
THOSE GRASSES THAT GO IN THERE, JUST SAY YOU DONE IT, THEY WILL CHOKE OUT ANYTHING, EVEN THE STUFF THAT'S ALIVE.
AND THEN WE HAD, WE HAD THE SAME PROBLEM ON SAYING IT TO YOU.
SO I DON'T WHERE THE GRASS ARE COMING FROM.
LIKE I SAID, I'VE SEEN IT WASHED IT CHOKE MARSH SAYING WHAT'S THE PROBLEM WITH THE GRASSES ARE STILL THERE AND THERE'S NO MARSH AND IT KILLED HEALTHY MARSH.
I, I MEANT TO SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THE, UM, IT'S A EELGRASS IT'S, IT'S DIED OFF AND THIS TIME OF THE YEAR USUALLY, UH, LATE JUNE, JULY AT THE LATEST STARTS TO DIE OFF.
AND THE EEL GRASS IS A GOOD THING AND IT'S OUT THERE AND THAT'S JUST A NORMAL PROCESS.
BUT YEAH, IT WILL CHOKE OUT THE GRASSES OVER THERE.
NO QUESTION ABOUT IT OUT THERE, BUT NOT GOOD THING FOR EXACTLY ON TOP OF YEAH.
SO THAT WAY IF YOU DID REPLANT THAT, THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE TOTALLY KIT THAT AREA.
I MEAN, I BREAK AWAY AND IT JUST COMES BACK.
BUT IT WILL CHOKE OFF ANYTHING THAT YOU'RE WRONG.
AND THEN IT WILL ALSO CHOKE ALL YOUR, WHAT YOU GOT HEALTHY.
AND YOU DO GOT SOME NICE HEALTHY MARSH GOING.
I DO, I HAVE PICTURES OF WHERE THAT, UM, IT, IT LIKE FORMS, LINES ACROSS THE MARCH WHERE YOU CAN SEE WHERE IT JUST MM-HMM
UM, I GUESS WHERE THE TIDE ENDED AND YEAH.
IT'S, IT'S EVERYTH BUT IT, IT, IT DOES HAVE TO BE PHYSICALLY REMOVED OR IT WILL CHOKE OFF EVEN YOUR HEALTHY GRASS THAT YOU'VE GOT GROWING.
SO MR. WARD, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD? QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? WELL, THE ONLY THING I THINK MR. PULASKI MENTIONED IT IN THE FIRST PART OF HIS PRESENTATION ABOUT FILLING, UH, UH, PERSONALLY I FEEL LIKE THE BEST SITUATION IS TO GIVE HIM PERMISSION TO FILL THAT ONE AREA WITH ENOUGH SAND OR BACKFILL.
SO THAT, UH, IT CAN BE PLUGGED PLUG.
WELL THAT'S WHAT YOU SAID ORIGINALLY, BUT NOW THERE SEEMS TO BE SOME, UH, VARIATION ON THAT.
FILL IS, IS WHAT WE'RE DISCUSSING AS YOU WELL KNOW, HARD TO GET SOMETHING TO GROW ON SAND.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT VERSUS SEEDING?
[01:00:01]
NOT REALLY, BUT OKAY.YOU, YOU DON'T, YOU CAN'T DIRECT, YOU CAN'T DIRECT SEED, THAT KIND OF THING.
JUST LIKE YOU CAN ON THE FARM WITH CERTAIN COMMODITIES.
BY THE TIME, UH, THEY, THEY, UH, GERMINATED, ET CETERA, UH, YOU, IT'S, IT'S GONE.
AND YOU CAN, YOU CAN ASK ANYBODY YOU'VE TALKED TO ABOUT IT.
NOW I'M OPEN TO A MOTION, PLEASE.
I MAKE A MOTION THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMIT MR. BEDROOM.
I MAKE A MOTION THAT THE APPLICANT SUBMIT A RESTORATION PLAN THAT IS APPROVED BY STAFF, UH, WITH A THREE YEAR MONITORING, AND THAT THE ELEVATION BE RAISED TO THE ADJACENT ELEVATION OF THE VEGETATED WETLANDS.
SECOND MOTION, SECOND VOTE PLEASE.
YOU KNOW HOW YOU STAND AT THIS MOMENT.
ANY LAST QUESTIONS OR ANYTHING? SO, UM, PLEASE APPROACH IF YOU'VE GOT SOMETHING TO SAY.
SO, I, I JUST WANNA UNDERSTAND SOMETHING.
SO I'VE SWORN BEFORE THIS BOARD THAT THERE WAS NO VEGETATION THERE THAT HAD WASHED AWAY FROM EROSION BEFORE THE PROJECT STARTED, BUT IT DOESN'T APPEAR THAT YOU'RE TAKING THAT AT FACE VALUE WHERE YOU DON'T BELIEVE ME.
HOWEVER, THIS GENTLEMAN HERE WHO HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT, JUST STOOD UP AND TOLD YOU WHAT HE SAW YEARS AGO AND YOU TOOK HIS OPINION AT FACE VALUE.
LAST MONTH YOU HAD HOMEOWNERS HERE WHO STARTED PROJECTS WITHOUT PERMITS AND YOU ALLOWED THEM TO COME FORWARD AND YOU ASKED THEM, WERE THERE ANY VEGETATED WETLANDS IMPACTED? THEY SAID NO.
EVERY ONE OF THEM WALKED ON THEIR WAY.
I HAVE DONE A TON TO SAVE VE VEGETATED WETLANDS A TON, BUT IT'S JUST NOT ENOUGH.
UH, WE, WE DON'T PLEASE, UH, WE KNOW YOU DIDN'T DO IT.
YOUR CONTRACTOR THAT YOU HIRED DID IT.
UH, MR. MUDD'S BEEN IN IT A LONG TIME.
MY QUESTION WAS, WERE THE BASKETS RUINED WHEN HE FIRST WENT OUT THERE AND WAS ASKED TO CONTRACT THE JOB? THAT'S ALL.
WERE THEY OPEN AND THE ROCK COMING OUT OF IT? THAT'S ALL.
UH, AND AND IT'S NOT THAT WE DID NOT BELIEVE YOU AS YOU LIKE TO SAY.
UM, I JUST WANTED TO HEAR IT FROM A CONTRACTOR THAT'S BEEN WORKING UP THERE LONGER THAN YOU'VE BEEN THERE.
IT'S NOT THAT WE DIDN'T BELIEVE YOU, WE WANTED TO HEAR SO, SO REGARDLESS OF THE FACT THAT I'VE TOLD YOU THAT, THAT THE WETLANDS IN THIS ONE SPOT HAD BEEN WASHED AWAY PRIOR TO THE WORK, UM, YOU WANT ME TO PUT DIRT THERE AND PLANT WITHOUT A PERMIT? UH, SIR, YOU CHOSE TO DO SOME OTHER THINGS.
IT WAS WORKING FOR YOU OR THEY STOLE IT.
BUT BECAUSE YOU HAD TO COME BEFORE THIS BOARD ABOUT A JPA, UH, YES SIR.
WHERE WE TOLD YOU WHAT WE THOUGHT WAS BEST FOR YOU, WHAT WE THOUGHT WAS BEST FOR YOUR PROPERTY AND BEST FOR THIS BOARD, WHAT WE DO FOR A LIVING, IF YOU CAN CALL IT THAT.
UH, AND THIS WILL NOW BE NEW BUSINESS, IF YOU DON'T MIND.
THIS IS, UH, MR. AND MRS. UH, EMIC.
UH, AND IT REGARDS, UM, A JOB, UH, 185 FEET OF BULKHEAD, UH, WITH FOUR AND SIX RETURN WALLS AND A, UM, LIFT.
AND THIS IS IN HOPKINS GENTLEMAN'S FOR ANY OLD FROM SHTE OR ANYWHERE.
HOPKINS IS, UH, UH, WEST OF PARKLEY.
SO IF YOU DON'T MIND, UH, SIR, UH, YOU'VE ALREADY BEEN SWORN IN MR. WATSON? YES.
WOULD YOU BRING US UP TO DATE? YES, SIR.
THIS IS A MANMADE BOAT BASIN, AT LEAST PARTIALLY MANMADE CANAL LEADING TO DIX COVE AND THEN BAGWELL CREEK, WHICH MM-HMM
[01:05:01]
CHESAPEAKE BAY.UH, THERE'S PRESENTLY A BULKHEAD THERE.
THIS IS JUST A REPLACEMENT TWO FEET SEAWARD AND THE PRESENT BULKHEADS FAILING.
UM, THE DECISION TOOLS CALLS FOR A LANDWARD REVETMENT OR A LANDWARD AS OPPOSED TO SEAWARD BULKHEAD THAT'S BEING PROPOSED HERE.
BUT THIS IS A MANMADE BASIN AND THE, UH, JURISDICTION OF THE BOARD ARE THE WETLANDS, UH, BETWEEN THE OLD BULKHEAD AND THOSE NEW BULKHEAD, WHICH IS, UH, 10 SQUARE FEET.
UM, HERE IS A OVERVIEW, I GUESS HOPKINS IS DOWN TO THE LEFT IF PROPERTY OBVIOUSLY IS THE YELLOW.
AND HERE'S A CLOSER UP OF THE PROPERTY SHOWING THE BOAT BASIN.
AND YOU CAN SEE THE WHITE EXISTING BULKHEAD AND DOCKS.
AND HERE ARE PICTURES OF THE LOCATION FROM ONE END AND THE OTHER END.
AND HERE IS THE NON VEGITATIVE WETLANDS AT ONE CORNER.
UM, I VISITED THE SITE SEVERAL TIMES AT LOW TIDE TO MAKE SURE I WASN'T HITTING A BLOWOUT LOW TIDE.
UM, AND IT, SO THIS WAS VERY CONSISTENT SHOWING AT LOW TIDE.
AND THIS MUD YOU SEE HERE WOULD BE BASICALLY, UH, THAT BOTTOM POLE OF THE PICTURE STANDING ON THE DOCK LOOKING STRAIGHT DOWN THAT END OF THE BOAT BASIN.
AND HERE'S ANOTHER PICTURE LOOKING STRAIGHT DOWN.
AND THIS IS THE, UH, EXISTING SITE CONDITIONS, UH, SHOWING THE TWO BLUE DOCKS ARE GONNA BE REMOVED AND THE BULKHEAD AND THE PROPOSAL BEFORE THE BOARD, UH, SHOWING THE RED TWO FEET SEAWARD BULKHEAD AND THE, UH, NEW DOCK BY THE BOAT RAMP AND THE BOAT LIFT COMING BACK IN HERE.
AND THESE ARE JUST SHOWING THE MEANS OF CONSTRUCTION FOR THE, UH, NEW BULKHEAD.
UM, IS GONNA BE A LITTLE TALLER TOO.
OR TWO ACTUALLY I CAN, EXCUSE ME, MR. BALL? YES.
HEY, CAN I HAVE YOU FOR A SECOND? UH, HOLD, HOLD ON.
YEAH, JUST EXCUSE ME SIR WATSON, IF YOU WOULD, ONE SECOND.
UH, MAY WE CONTINUE OR DO WE NEED TO DISCUSS SOMETHING? THANK YOU.
I MEANT TO TAKE THIS OUT BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY THE BOAT LIFT IN, IN FRONT OF THE BOARD, BUT THIS IS SHOWING THE BOAT LIFT THAT'S, THAT, UH, WOULD BE RIGHT ALONG THE NEW BULKHEAD.
AND FINALLY JUST SHOWING THE BULKHEAD WITH THE DEAD MIM AND WHERE THE WATER, UH, MEAN LOW HIGH AND MEAN LOW, UH, ARE ON THE FACE OF EXISTING BULKHEAD, EXCEPT OF COURSE FOR THE 10 SQUARE FEET OF NON VEGETATIVE WETLANDS.
AND, UH, THAT'S IT AS FAR AS MY PRESENTATION ON THIS.
ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. WATSON? ALRIGHT.
DID YOU SAY THE, UH, BOAT LAMP ON THE, THIS WAS NOT IN THE APPLICATION.
IT IS IN THE APPLICATION, BUT IT'S TREATED JUST LIKE AN OPEN PILE PIER SUCH THAT IT'S, UH, EXEMPT FROM REVIEW.
UH, REPRESENTING, UM, THE ANEMIC IS MUD CONSTRUCTION.
JOHN, WOULD YOU APPROACH, I DON'T THINK I'VE SWORN YOU IN, MAYBE I DO YOU, UH, AGREE THAT YOU'LL TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? YES, SIR.
AND ALL MATTERS BEFORE THIS BOARD.
UH, JUST TYPICAL COOKIE CUTTER, BULKHEAD REPLACEMENT, TWO FOOT IN FRONT.
UM, THEY ENDED UP FINDING A LITTLE BIT OF MUD ON THE FAR END.
UH, SO I PUT DOWN 16 SQUARE FOOT, THEY CAME UP WITH 10 SQUARE FOOT.
SO I'M JUST HERE FOR YOU GUYS TO SAY, GO AHEAD WITH IT.
WELL SIR, WE'LL DECIDE IF IT'S NOT MUCH DIFFERENCE.
ALRIGHT SIR, ANYTHING ELSE EXCEPT WHAT WE HAVE LEARNED AND WHAT WE SEE HERE REGARDING THE JPA? ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. MUDD, PLEASE? ALRIGHT SIR.
[01:10:01]
THANK YOU.DON'T LEAVE US, UH, ANYONE ELSE IN THE ROOM WISH TO SPEAK ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR JPA, NOT A CLOSED FLOOR, OPEN TO PUBLIC COMMENT.
WE'LL TAKE A TWO MINUTE TIME OUT HERE.
YOU HAVE SOMETHING YOU WISH TO? NO, NO, I WOULD JUST LETTING YOU KNOW THAT I FULFILLED THEIR REQUEST.
UM, NOW WE OPEN THE, UH, TO THE BOARD, PLEASE, UH, ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS FROM THE BOARD OR HAD A CALL FOR A MOTION.
AND A SECOND I'LL MAKE A MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT THE APPLICATION AS PRESENTED.
THE MITIGATION, UH, SHOULD BE IN THE, HAS TO BE IN THE MITIGATION.
WE ACCEPT THE APPLICATION AS PRESENTED, INCLUDING A 10 FOOT, 10 SQUARE FOOT MEDICATION.
BUT WE, WHERE DOES IT GO? THAT'S THE
I THINK, UH, NUMBER ONE, I GUESS WE NEED TO SAY NON VEGITATIVE AND NUMBER TWO, WE NEED TO SPECIFY THE MEANS OF, OF, OF, I CAN'T HEAR YOU SIR.
WHAT WAS THE LAST COMMENT? AND, AND THE OTHER THING IS WHETHER WE NEED TO SPECIFY, UH, THE MEANS OF SATISFYING THE OBLIGATION.
UM, AS FAR AS, UH, WETLAND MITIGATION BANK, UH, DOES THE VIRGINIA AQUATIC TRUST FUND HAVE, UH, CREDITS IS, I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT, BUT IF THAT'S THE REQUIREMENT THAT WE CAN FIGURE THAT OUT AFTERWARDS, BUT IT JUST, THE TYPE OF MITIGATION NEEDS TO BE CLEAR.
SO I THINK WETLAND, UH, I, UM, I THINK THE PROPER LANGUAGE WOULD BE NON VEGITATIVE WETLANDS, UH, PURCHASED FROM AN APPROVED IN LIEU FEE PROGRAM.
UH, LEMME START AGAIN, MR. WARD.
UM, AND WE KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON.
YOU GUYS HAVE A GOOD DAY YOUR TIME.
UM, THE NEXT THING IS OTHER BUSINESS AND ITS POLICIES AND PROCEDURES.
THE LAST THING MR. WATSON, CARRY ON.
THE LAST THING WE HAVE ARE UNPAID IN LIEU FEES.
UM, ACTUALLY STARTED WITH A VERY LONG LIST, BUT IT TURNS OUT A LOT OF PROJECTS HAVE NOT BEEN DONE.
OBVIOUSLY PEOPLE DON'T OWE THE IN LIE FEES IF THEY HADN'T BEEN DONE.
BUT WE HAVE GONE THROUGH THE LIST AND CHECKED ALL THE PROJECTS AND THESE WERE THE LAST THREE THAT HAVE BEEN DONE.
UM, ALL CAPTAIN'S COVE, ALL REPLACEMENT BULKHEADS AND OBVIOUSLY THE KLI FIGURE IS VERY SMALL.
THE OTHER TWO ARE OBVIOUSLY OF SOME CONSEQUENCE.
AND ALL OF THESE BULKHEADS HAVE BEEN BUILT.
I'VE GONE OUT AND VISUALLY LOOKED AT 'EM AND CONFIRMED THEY HAVE BEEN BUILT.
AND, UM, BICK WAS THE CONTRACTOR FOR ALL THREE.
UM, SO THERE WERE NO WETLANDS OR BUILDING PERMITS FOR KLEE OR BUCKLAND.
THERE WERE BUILDING PERMIT APPLICATIONS.
THE BUILDING PERMITS WERE NOT ISSUED.
IF SOMETHING'S NOT SUFFICIENT IN THE APPLICATION, THAT'S WHAT WE SEND BACK.
AND THEN WE NEVER GOT ANYTHING TO, YOU KNOW, SATISFY THAT CONDITION.
SO THE BUILDING PERMITS WERE NOT ISSUED.
THE WETLANDS AND THE BUILDING PERMITS WERE ISSUED FOR BURKE, OBVIOUSLY, UH, THAT WAS A MISTAKE.
UM, UH, BUT SO WE HAVE ONE THAT IT WAS PERMITTED AND TWO THAT WERE NOT PERMITTED, BUT ALL THREE OF THE AMOUNTS HAVE BEEN PAID, I MEAN, HAVE NOT BEEN PAID.
AND UH, THE LAST THING TO NOTE IS THAT THE KIZ, IF I'M SAYING THAT NAME CORRECTLY, ACTUALLY SOLD THEIR PROPERTY TO SOMEBODY ELSE, UH, A COUPLE YEARS AGO.
THE OTHER TWO, UH, BUCKLIN AND BURKE ARE STILL THE OWNERS OF THE PROPERTY.
I HAVE SENT LETTERS, UM, TO ALL OF THE OWNERS AND THAT WAS, UH, OVER A MONTH AGO BECAUSE IT WAS IN ADVANCE OF THE LAST HEARING AND I HAVE NOT HEARD BACK FROM ANYONE.
ALTHOUGH I HAVE SPOKEN TO THE OLSONS WHO ARE THE PURCHASERS OF THE KALIA PROPERTY AND THEY DID EXPRESS A
[01:15:01]
WILLINGNESS TO PAY THE AMOUNT.UM, AND I, UH, I I'M HOPEFUL TO GET BACK IN TOUCH WITH THEM.
IT, IT'S ONLY $36 RAIN, THEY'LL GET BACK TO YOU.
SO WE'RE REALLY DEALING WITH, WITH TWO MOST LIKELY CORRECT.
THEY, THEY WERE, THE OLSONS WERE VERY COOPERATIVE AND, UM, UH, IT WAS ONLY ABOUT LESS THAN A COUPLE WEEKS AGO I SPOKE TO HIM AND I TOLD HIM ABOUT THE UPCOMING HEARING AND UM, I NEED TO GET BACK WITH HIM TO GET THAT PAYMENT ARRANGED.
ALRIGHT, SIR, ANY QUESTIONS PLEASE, REGARDING THIS, I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT OUR OPTIONS ARE.
UH, THAT'S A VERY GOOD QUESTION.
I'D ALSO LIKE TO KNOW, UH, WHAT ARE, WHAT OPTIONS DO WE HAVE IF THEY DON'T PAY? SO MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT I'M NOT, I'M NOT SUGGESTING THAT THIS IS BEING SUGGESTED, BUT THAT, THAT BMRC WOULD TAKE A DIM VIEW IF OF, OF ANY EXCUSING OF THESE AMOUNTS.
UM, AND, UH, SO WERE THEY, WELL, I WOULD JUST SAY THAT AT LEAST WITH, UH, BUCKLAND, THAT IS A VIOLATION IN THAT THE WORK WAS DONE WITHOUT A WETLANDS OR A BUILDING PERMIT AND WITHOUT THE MITIGATION FEE PAID.
UM, IT'S A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED FOR BURKE BECAUSE THAT ACTUALLY WAS SOMETHING THAT PERMITS WERE ISSUED ON.
IT DOESN'T MEAN THEY DON'T OWE THE MONEY.
BUT I, I INTENDED, I WOULD SAY PERSONALLY TO BRING THIS TO THE BOARD'S ATTENTION TODAY, TO OBVIOUSLY DEVISE A PLAN, WHICH IS NOW WHAT YOU'RE ASKING, AND TO POTENTIALLY HAVE A HEARING SUCH THAT I WOULD SEND A CERTIFIED LETTER TO THE OWNERS ADVISING THEM THAT THESE AMOUNTS WERE DUE AND THAT, YOU KNOW, IF THEY WEREN'T PAID BEFORE THE NEXT WETLANDS BOARD MEETING OR, AND WHAT BOARD MEETING AFTER THAT, WE WOULD HAVE A HEARING AND UH, AND JUDGMENT ON PROPERTY.
IS THAT IN THE CARDS IF THEY JUST DON'T PAY? OR HOW'S THAT WORK? I WOULD SAY THAT MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT WE CERTAINLY WOULD NOT HAVE, UH, LIKE A, AN AUTOMATIC LIEN ARISING FROM THE WETLANDS BOARD'S, UH, ASSESSMENT.
UM, WE WOULD UH, BUT YOU WOULD'VE TO GO BEFORE THE JUDGE WOULD.
SO THAT I'M SAYING IT'S GONNA LOOK, IF, IF YOU GOT, IF HE'S, UH, THAT PERMIT WAS DONE, WE JUST GO BEFORE THE JUDGE.
I THINK THE JUDGE WOULD LOOK FAVORABLY ON JUST BE THAT EASY TO PUT THE JUDGMENT ON THE PROPERTY AND IT WOULD BE TAKEN CARE OF REAL FAST BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT JUDGMENTS ON THE PROPERTY.
THEY HAVE ANY MONIES RIGHT THERE ON THE PROPERTY.
I MAY, THAT'S THIS THE EASIEST, EASIEST WAY TO GO.
'CAUSE LIKE I SAID, WHEN YOU GO BEFORE THE ACK COUNTY JUDGE, I THINK, UH, HE'S GONNA UNDERSTAND THIS IS REAL EASY.
IT WAS, IT'S A LEGITIMATE BILL.
I GUESS IT'S LEGITIMATE, UH, PROJECT, WHICH THEY'VE ALREADY DONE.
IT WAS SUPPOSED TO HAVE BEEN PAID.
AND IT'S, IT'S, TO ME IT'S THAT EASY.
UM, OBVIOUSLY THE PROBLEMS IF MITIGATION'S NOT PAID AND THE WORK'S DONE.
UM, BUT THEY DID TELL ME THAT, SO I WANTED TO PASS THAT ON.
I, I DON'T THINK THAT'S THE BEST WAY TO HANDLE THINGS.
BUT THAT'S MR THAT'S THE WAY THEY HANDLE IT.
WOULD THEY, WOULD THEY SUPPOSE HAVE GOTTEN A PERMIT, UH, THE BILL WITHOUT THE, UH, MITIGATION BEING PAID? IN THE CASE OF THE PERMIT BEING ISSUED FOR BURKE? UM, THAT WAS, UH, A, A FEW YEARS AGO.
I CAN TELL YOU NOW, WE DO NOT ISSUE THE PERMIT UNTIL WE HAD THE MONEY.
UM, I WOULD ASSUME IT WAS THE SAME POLICY BACK THEN SORT OF OUR FAULT TOO.
IT'S, IT'S SORT OF OUR FAULT TOO.
BUT, SO THEY DIDN'T PAY, SO WE REALLY GOT TWO DIFFERENT SITUATIONS.
ONE IS THERE WAS NO PERMIT ISSUED.
AND THE MITIGATION FEE HAD NOT BEEN PAID.
AND THE OTHER ONE, THE PERMIT HAD BEEN ISSUED AND THE MITIGATION FEE HAD NOT BEEN PAID.
SO THE ONE WHERE THE PERMIT WASN'T ISSUED PROBABLY FALLS BACK TO US SINCE IT WASN'T AN ISSUED PERMIT.
UH, AND I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING WE CAN HANDLE.
THE OTHER ONE WHERE THE PERMIT HAD BEEN ISSUED AND THE MITIGATION FEE WAS NOT PAID.
I, I THINK THAT'S LIKE, UH, I THINK THAT'S GONNA BE A, A, A COURT ISSUE THERE.
WELL THINK THERE'S NO WEATHER OR BILLING PERMITS.
[01:20:01]
24 70 JPA 2023.WERE THEY ALL APPROVED BY THIS BOARD? THEY WERE ALL APPROVED.
SO, SO A WETLAND PERMIT, WETLANDS BOARD, UH, WE APPROVED, WE, WE DID APPROVE.
WELL IT SOUNDS HERE LIKE I JUST NO WETLAND.
WELL, SO THE PROCEDURE, UM, IS THAT ONCE THE BOARD APPROVES A PERMIT IN SESSION, THEN WE HAVE A WRITTEN PIECE OF PAPER, UH, THAT MR. BIRD SIGNS.
UM, AND WE DO NOT CALL HIM TO SIGN IT UNTIL WE HAVE THE MONEY AND THEN THEY CANNOT START.
AND WE WILL NOT ISSUE A BUILDING PERMIT UNTIL WE HAVE ISSUED THAT SIGNED PERMIT PIECE OF PAPER SHOWING THEY'VE PAID AND IT'S BEEN ISSUED.
SO ONE CASE WAS THAT WE SHOULDN'T HAVE DONE THE PERMIT.
SO WHAT I'M SAYING, WE WE'RE, WE'RE, UM, I'M NOT STICKING UP FOR ANYTHING OR ANYBODY, BUT WE CAN'T BE MAKING A MISTAKE AND THEN BE WANTING TO KILL SOMEBODY FOR MAKING ANOTHER MISTAKE.
MISTAKE, YOU KNOW, AS 1, 1, 1, 1 DONE WRONG, REDONE, WRONG.
BUT LIKE I SAID, BUT WE'VE GOTTA TAKE CARE OF THE SITUATION.
AND ME, LIKE YOU SAY THAT THIS ONE THING TOO.
I THINK BOTH, I KNOW IF I WAS A HOMEOWNER AND I COULD SAY I LOOK ON MY CONTRACT THAT I'M SUPPOSED TO PAY IT AND I KNOW SOMEBODY'S GONNA PUT A JUDGMENT AGAINST MY HOUSE, I'M GONNA PAY IT.
WELL, I WILL SAY THAT I, AND I HAVE TALKED TO VIC ABOUT TRYING TO GET IN TOUCH WITH THESE PEOPLE.
UH, AND OUR SYSTEM, WE DO NOT HAVE GOOD PHONE NUMBERS FOR, UH, EITHER BURKE OR BUCKLIN.
AND THE PHONE NUMBERS THEY PROVIDED ME WERE NOT GOOD EITHER.
SO THEY, I HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO, WE HAVE THEIR ADDRESSES THOUGH.
WE HAVE RIGHT ON TAX MAP NUMBERS, WE'LL HAVE THEIR ADDRESS AND THEN WE NEED TO SEND 'EM A BILL.
LIKE YOU SAY, THIS IS WHAT THIS IS, IT WAS NOT PAID, THIS IS WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE.
AND HOPEFULLY THEY'LL JUST SEND US A CHECK.
IF NOT, THEN WE HAVE TO TAKE, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T HAVE TO THREATEN 'EM, JUST, JUST SEND 'EM A BILL.
I SENT 'EM LETTERS APPROXIMATELY, WELL, MORE THAN FIVE WEEKS AGO.
'CAUSE IT WAS MORE THAN A WEEK IN ADVANCE OF THE LAST HEARING AND I HAVE NOT HEARD BACK FROM YOU ANYMORE.
THEN MR. CHAIRMAN, I WOULD MAKE A SUGGESTION.
WE'VE SEND 'EM REGISTERED LETTERS THAT THEY HAVE TO SIGN FOR AND THEN THEY GOT IT AND THAT'S GONNA HELP US WITH IT.
WHEN WE GO, WHEN WE GO BEFORE THE JUDGE.
SO THAT WOULD BE MY, MY SUGGESTION THAT WE MAKE, WE SEND 'EM, UH, REGISTERED LETTERS THAT THEY HAVE TO SIGN FOR THAT WE NEED GET, OH, I NEVER GOT IT.
YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? SO THAT SENT 'EM REGISTERED LETTERS AND, AND THEN LIKE I SAID, WE'LL TAKE IT FROM THERE.
BUT IS THAT AN ISSUE, SIR? IT'S NOT.
I'D SAY THERE'S NO, OBVIOUSLY THESE THINGS ARE BUILT, THERE'S NO SENSE OF PARTICULAR SENSE OF URGENCY.
IT'S NOT LIKE YES SIR, BUT REGISTERED, WE'LL GIVE YOU SOME PROOF THAT THEY RECEIVED IT.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM THE BOARD ON ANY SUBJECT FROM TODAY? ALRIGHT, FIRST OF ALL, I'D LIKE, UH, TO HAVE MR. EARL FREDERICK RECOGNIZED WHO RAN THIS THING FOR MANY, MANY YEARS.
AND I HOPE HE'S HERE TO FIND OUT HOW WE DO IT AND COME BACK AND DO IT AGAIN SOMETIME.
THANK YOU FOR COMING YOUNG MAN.
THERE'S ALWAYS AN OPENING FOR YOU,
OH YEAH, WE SHOULD, WE SHOULD HAVE COME UP THERE.
UM, SO THE NEXT MEETING WILL BE, UM, AUGUST THE 28TH, 10 O'CLOCK RIGHT HERE.
AND I HAVE, UH, WELL MAYBE ONE OR TWO APPLICATIONS THAT ARE BEING THAT, THAT I'VE HAD FOR QUITE SOME TIME.
BUT I HAVE PEOPLE OWING ME THINGS ON BOTH THAT I'M SO YOU WILL NOT PRESENT THEM TO US TODAY.
UM, THEY ARE BOTH PROMISED ME THE LAST BIT OF INFORMATION AND UH, I'VE GOT MY FINGERS CROSSED THEY'LL GET IT TO ME.
UH, ANY OTHER COMMENTS? AND I WOULD JUST SAY AS SOON AS I GET THAT LAST BIT, I'LL BE MAILING THEM OUT.
YOU KNOW, IN WHICH I'VE GIVEN 'EM DEADLINES OF, UH, TUESDAY IS THE DROP DEAD DATE FOR THE LAST BIT OF INFORMATION.
ONE, ONE QUICK QUESTION ON THE, UH, THE PROJECT THAT WAS, UH, THE MITIGATION OR RESTORATION.
UH, I DIDN'T PUT IN THERE, UH, A TIMEFRAME TO SUBMIT THAT.
SO AFTER ABOUT 60 DAYS, IF YOU HAVEN'T HEARD ANYTHING, I THINK I WOULD BRING IT BACK TO US.
THANKS FOR THE, UH, TIME PERIOD.
YEAH, I WAS, I WAS GONNA BRING IT BACK UP IN THE NEXT MEETING, BUT OBVIOUSLY I'LL GIVE HIM 60.
THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S I THINK'S REASONABLE OR HE'LL TAKE IT TO COURT OR WHATEVER HE'S GONNA DO.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? THANK YOU GENTLEMEN.
KNOW, I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY HE DOESN'T WANT.